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Globe weighs in on South End / Roxbury border
By Ron Newman on Sat, 12/26/2009 - 8:51am
That argument we have here any time there's a news story about the area behind Northeastern University? The Globe has picked it up.
My personal opinion? Sussex Street is Roxbury, since it was part of the separate city of Roxbury before Boston annexed it in 1868.
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Comments
Today must be Local Identity day at the Globe
They also have a story about the authenticity of McDonald's What It Means to be from New England campaign.
Great article
It's a great article and gives more useful information to help make a decison. That two, long-time residents differ in opinion shows there's no clear demarkation.
I was annoyed by this:
ZIP code is what got Northeastern University in trouble with Roxbury residents years ago when the mailing address for the president’s office was listed as Boston and not Roxbury, where the university is primarily located.
There's no "Roxbury" city in Massachusetts. There's only "Boston". When I send mail to other people in the city, I use "Boston", not "Dorchester" or "Roxbury". The Post Office has neighborhoods because the ZIP codes signify which branch the mail comes from.
Agreed
I usually use "Boston" in my address when dealing with people outside the city, only because most cities don't do this neighborhood-as-city crap. If I put "Roxbury" as my address when I'm giving my info to a customer service person at my health insurance company or something, they'll then be like "OK...how close are you to Boston?" when they're trying to figure out what I should do. But when dealing with people in the city, I'll use the neighborhoods, or else most people think "Boston" means I'm downtown. The program where I work is in Dorchester, and when fliers and things give our address as "Boston," (usually when prepared by one of the state agencies referring people to us, since we always use "Dorchester") then many of the families in Dorchester will see this and say "oh, I'm not going all the way to Boston to get my kid evaluated." *headdesk*
Oh, and I don't get what's up with people thinking Northeastern's address is an attempt to distance themselves from Roxbury. They deal with a lot of prospective students from outside the area, and I'm guessing they don't want them saying "oh, Roxbury Massachusetts? Is that anywhere near Boston?" Since part of the appeal of Northeastern is that you choose it if you want to be right in a bigish city.
There are N Washington Streets in the city
so if you tell someone you live on "Washington Street in Boston", when you actually live on the one in Brighton, that's a good way to get someone entirely lost. This is one big reason for the persistence of neighborhood names in street addresses.
New York City is the other place I know of which uses neighborhood names in street addresses ... though they seem to be of varying granularity -- "Brooklyn" covers a whole borough, but "Long Island City" is just one little part of Queens.
Right
If someone is coming to my house, I tell them "Roxbury." If someone is in another state trying to figure out if their business has an office near me, or figure out what delivery zone I'm in or something, I tell them "Boston."
Roxbury vs. West Roxbury
I cannot count the number of times I've told someone that I live in Roxbury, and they come back with "Oh, I have a cousin/friend/aunt who lives in West Roxbury".
Did I SAY West? I did not.
Then they're usually surprised and alarmed when I clarify, "Not WEST Roxbury, just Roxbury", because the perception is still that white people don't live in Roxbury.
By the way, re: the article itself, was Roxbury really "Rocksberrry" with three R's in a row like that?
I was annoyed by this: ZIP
ZIP code is what got Northeastern University in trouble with Roxbury residents years ago when the mailing address for the president’s office was listed as Boston and not Roxbury, where the university is primarily located."
It's not surprising a real estate weasel should be annoyed, as real estate weasels have caused much of the problem over the years. It was real estate agents who pushed to cut Mission Hill off from Roxbury so that they could disassociate the district from "black Roxbury" and get higher prices. It's not hard to understand why long-time black residents of Roxbury should be offended at white people lopping off the fringe of their community to stuff their pockets.
How hostile
I'm a proud South End, long-time Boston resident.
I think you should be nicer. Calling someone a "weasel" is rude and unnecessary.
Northeastern used to be much-more focused on the "Fenway" side of the city - facing Huntington Ave and further toward the "city" side of things. Only during the past decade and a half has it expanded toward Columbus Ave, by building new classrooms and dormitories. In fact, it was when it expanded into "their" neighborhood (Roxbury) that neighborhood officials (Chuck Turner, I believe) complained about it.
I didn't know Mission Hill used to be considered Roxbury. I always considered them separate and distinct. I'll have to check my old maps.
As the Globe article made clear, even long-time residents on the South End/Roxbury border aren't in agreement about their neighborhood - one said he liked being considered South End while the other liked Roxbury.
As I said, the demarkation is as much a result of the Post Office as it is anything else. And, I don't think the Post Office should be used as the decider.
I'll have to ask my real estate clients in those neighborhoods which they prefer. Mostly, they were just pleased they were able to find good, safe neighborhoods in which to live and raise their children. And, pleased with my services.
some real estate people are weasels
Agents conveniently list a property as located in 'Boston' when it is really in 'Roxbury' and another property as 'West Roxbury' when it could justly be listed as in 'Boston' as well. It is obvious why they do this - fewer people will look at a property if it's listed as in Roxbury instead of Boston due to the areas reputation and perception....
Few sincere people will argue this point - those who profit due to a locations distinction will usually argue whatever is in their favor... not all but most real estate agents.
Um
FYI: agents entering a listing into LINK and MLSPIN must add a Boston neighborhood. You can't use "Boston" as default.