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Anti-abortion people scream at his wife; he screams right back

Aaron Gouveia videoed his confrontation with two anti-abortion protesters outside Women's Health Services on Harvard Street earlier this year. He accompanied his wife there to have an abortion after doctors told them their 16-week-old fetus, the one they'd already picked out a name for, had mermaid syndrome, no kidneys, no bladder and no chance of surviving. And, he writes (cached version), he couldn't take it when these two women started screaming at his wife:

... Hell is watching her entire body convulse with sobs because she's being tortured with grief. For as long as I live and no matter how many children we have, I will never forget that sound. And I vowed to do everything in my power to make sure she’d never make it again.

Across a crowded street, two people with "God Is Pro-Life!" signs and pictures of torn-up fetuses managed to drive the blade in even deeper. Again, I was left trying to console the inconsolable, feeling even more helpless this time, because I wasn't allowed into surgery with her.

Running on pure adrenaline, and without even a hint of a plan, I grabbed my cell phone and crossed the street. ...

H/t Michael and Salon.

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Comments

Intentional infliction of emotional distress, anyone?

I'm all for free speech, but these people's preaching of religious views at people who haven't asked to share in them and spewing of scientific inaccuracies would be equally (in)effective if they were to just make a website or a zine or something, without having to involve harassing anyone.

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1. Ask them why they aren't out protesting the wars. The stock response usually is "War is a necessary evil, our soldiers our protecting our freedoms!" To which I reply "Yes, including the freedom of abortion, no?" That's when they call me an obscenity and walk away.

2. Ask why there were no women present when Bush signed the partial birth abortion ban.

3. Ask them why they only protest in affluent white neighborhoods, don't they care about the little black babies? One actually said there is a separate black anti-abortion movement, and they have "those" neighborhoods covered.

4.Ask if them if they would like to change their signs from "Abortion kills babies" to "I will support you and your child until it's eighteen if you don't go in there" One actually told me that's why they have food stamps and welfare, so they do support them with their taxes.

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Rock on. Seriously. He rocks.

These jerks depend on people who feel bad enough about abortion in theory that they feel ashamed about doing what they feel is best and are legally entitled to do. They want to make a personal medical decision off limits for everyone. Except themselves because that's different. In their world, there are no problem pregnancies, no birth defects, no fetal demise in utero, no life threatening complications, no other already born children to tend to and no bodily autonomy either - at least not for women.

And he never once used the word Bitch. His restraint is amazing in the face of his grief and righteous anger. Bravo, sir. Bravo.

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I had a different impression from the text I read first, and my preconceptions, before I started watching the videos. I was imagining fury, but he's way too calm, and the women are just dimwits.

It's too bad that there are so many dimwits, and that they vote in the same elections that I do. But these women are far from the worst of the anti-abortion protesters.

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Give me a call next time.

I always shout down the ones in Packard's Corner when I see them.

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I think that this dad was RIGHT! People like that are just plain stupid! I am against abortion BUT, If there is a medical reason and not just "because mom doesn't want to pay for what she did" then that is fine and good. People really make me mad because they have no idea what they are doing. Why don't they protest on Washington DC to start helping feed american children and not worry about those over seas??

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NEWS FLASH!!! It takes two to make a baby! If mothers and fathers would start teaching their sons responsibility and eliminate the 'boys will be boys' attitude then maybe there will be less unwanted pregnancies in this world.

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Why just mom? Takes two to tango. That was a really bad statement on your part.

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Powerful anecdote from Mr. Gouveia and remarkable presence of mind to start snapping pictures while his wife was inside enduring such a procedure. That said, mermaid syndrome is as rare as Siamese Twins. How does this relate to the other approximately 52,008,664 unborn children who have been terminated since Roe?
---
"The doctor said, 'He can't last a week.' And I did. And they said, 'There's no way this kid's going to last a month.' And I did. And so they said, 'Two years. He's not going to make it.' Two years. 'Five years. He can't do that.' I lived to be five years. 'He's never going to hit double digits.' And here I am, a new teenager." -- Mattie Stepanek (1990-2004) American Author/poet, with 7 books to reach New York Times bestsellers list

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Um, are you on glue? Matt Stepanek lived to the ripe 'ol age of FOURTEEN. A remarkable human being, yes. But as for the other 52 million "terminated children" you speak of? Well, in all seriousness, they never knew what they missed. BECAUSE THEY WEREN'T BORN YET. And as for their 52 million mothers? They got the chance to maybe grow up, attend college, get a job, change the world, and become something besides a teenage mother with a deadbeat boyfriend, who leaves his baby mama with a crying infant and unpaid bills. THAT'S how it relates, HOME BOY!

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Amen, and bravo, Megan! One day we'll make them understand.

Well, given who they are, probably not.

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Way to go Megan! I was thinking the same thing!

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Your heartfelt rant loses credibility when you clearly didn't even do enough research to find out what twins who are born attached are called, let alone how common that occurrence is.

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I don't really see how it defeat the point that Mermaid syndrome is rare. The main point still stands. All you accomplished is eliminated a side point and resort to name calling.

Yes, I am the pro-life side of things. For things like Mermaid syndrome, I see the ends justify the means. For a teenage girl with little resources, a deadbeat boyfriend, and low ability to turn to family, I find that a lot more gray. There are also a large cross-section of people who do abortions for convenience. I can't stand by that.

Now to Megan, I see there's a legitimate point. You're right, any aborted baby, since they were never born, have no idea what they missed out. To be fair, for some, they might not have missed much anyways. However, taking a nihilist point of view, when we die, we lose existence and therefore have no idea anymore either. There's limit of "never knowing what one missed out." Unless you want to view that existence doesn't matter to ourselves anyway.

I do not know any of those people, so I can't really judge them. I hope that you reserve some open mindedness to some of the arguments on both sides, rather than knee-jerk hostility.

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I find none of it to be any of your business.

Up to the date of viability, it is the business of the person whose body is the sole support for something that cannot exist without it.
Debating this is like saying "but I need your kidney to survive - why can't I just use the law to force you to give me something I would die without". It simply isn't debatable, unless you are the one who is pregnant and debating it with yourself. You are saying that the law should force someone to use their body to sustain another entity when they choose not to.

There are no valid non-religious reasons beyond viability to support a legal intrusion into a personal medical decision. Full stop.

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I respect all people as human beings, but I really don't have any tolerance for people who think that someone else's safe and legal medical procedure should be the business of anyone but that person and that person's doctor.

I fully respect each person's opinions as to which medical procedures they choose to have and not to have. But beyond that, I would hope they would have the decency to have some boundaries.

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There are also a large cross-section of people who do abortions for convenience.

Can you please reference this assertion?

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Since it the line of thought make more sense to me addressing backwards, I will do that.

@Lecil - Now there's no article on the NYT that denotes the cross-section. It would be rather difficult and, frankly, unpopular in these circles to try and push it. The difficulty stems from not only that most people will not view themselves that they are only doing it for "convenience," but it is also a gray area. Not many will view it as such, and even those who do, will not admit it. People can reason themselves into many things.

For example, one scenario that a baby means going to college later and diverting large amount of energy to upbringing rather than career/life goals. For many, that is virtually the end of their world. Therefore, an abortion is a justified act. However, many people start college later in life all the time (immigrants looking for a bachelors to advance their careers is most common I seen) and a slowed down career is definitely not equal to teenage pregnancy, bearing a child from rape, or unbearable defects.

Still, while I can't cite something that says "I did it because the baby will be a pain in the arse." I can show a few links to a few things.

Let's start with the weakest link:

http://answers.yahoo.com/question/index?qid=20101025173657AADOwKY

The above is just arguably hearsay. It can even be made up! Still, one can reasonable see someone saying that line. Within 40 million, one stands to see that is probable.

http://www.nytimes.com/1989/10/13/us/rape-and-incest-just-1-of-all-abortions.html

The above states that basically 1% of abortions are abortions by rape victims. Granted, it is old, but I doubt the number have went up, especially a quick look on wikipedia (and don't go into the argument that wikipedia is not an acceptable reference) shows that rape have went down over the years.


http://www.abortionfacts.com/statistics/age.asp

Abortion facts seems to be a pretty neutral site to cite from. That above shows the statistics of abortions by age. It is arguable that teenage abortions is a necessity as they do not have the resources to raise a child or at least a very difficult time. However, age groups of 25-29 have percentages in the 20's with the 30-34 being the mid 10's. It is much more likely that by that age, abortion by financial necessity seem much less likely.

Diseases requires a lot more research. I don't think there been a large spike in number of diseases like the one that man had that would necessitate abortions except autism, but a good proportions are milder ones like Aspergers's and the rise have not been that dramatic (and it is arguably been a case of higher diagnosis as well).

So taking account of abortions by rape victims (1-5%), upcoming birth defects/conditions (unknown, but babies with birth defects are not very common), and inability to raise a child (which is usually teenage and early 20's women and adds up to 30-45%), that still leaves a large percentage that leave the question: why do you need an abortion?

@eeka - Well, that is unfortunate. Now I don't condone a line of people scream insults to whoever walk through that door, but on topics on abortion, it is impossible as it is a topic of ethics. For example, some people now and back then seem it was perfectly and morally acceptable to have segregation (and slavery earlier). To their morality, there is nothing wrong, in fact, they can view that intermingling with another race is "morally wrong." To have an opinion that discrimination is an injustice means conflict. You can just keep that opinion to oneself and live with it.

@swirlygrrl What you started is the famous violinist thought experiment. There been many arguments and counter arguments from the most common of people to the dissent voices in the supreme court. Personally, it is a matter if the right to life or the right to your body is more important. I say life is the highest of all levels of ethics. So the question to me "is the fetus a living, human being?" To be honest, I'm not really sure on that part.

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The difficulty stems from not only that most people will not view themselves that they are only doing it for "convenience," but it is also a gray area. Not many will view it as such, and even those who do, will not admit it. People can reason themselves into many things.

You're making huge assumptions about the needs and motivations of others then. Just, may I point out, as were the women doing the original screaming which set off this particular thread. Doesn't matter how reasonably you state it; you are projecting your own needs and motivations on others with little to no personal knowledge of their situations.

So the question to me "is the fetus a living, human being?" To be honest, I'm not really sure on that part.

Given that this is a question only answerable by one's own ethical decision process, doesn't it then make sense that the over all issue needs to be left to each individual?

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You're making huge assumptions about the needs and motivations of others then. Just, may I point out, as were the women doing the original screaming which set off this particular thread. Doesn't matter how reasonably you state it; you are projecting your own needs and motivations on others with little to no personal knowledge of their situations.

If am only projecting my needs and motivations, you are no better. Just different assumptions. I doubt you know the individual situations of each of the 40 million abortions anymore than I do. However, I done the best I could on looking on the needs and motivations in abortion and gave some citations. On this topic, there is almost no source that is not tainted by some level of bias.

Given that this is a question only answerable by one's own ethical decision process, doesn't it then make sense that the over all issue needs to be left to each individual?

I would like to agree, but I cannot. I just see a flaw in that argument. If one view that abortion is murder, it is equivalent as a murder between two adults. One of the adult can easily say that they see no wrong in their action, but, unless you have the same view or something close enough to be permissive, you cannot let it slide by saying the adult just have a different view of ethics.

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So, on the one hand, this father's argument should be dismissed because he's just quoting a super rare occurrence to justify abortion...

On the other hand, you quoted a super rare occurrence of someone living to the ripe ol' age of FOURTEEN to justify not aborting every most likely stillborn fetus?

You can't have it both ways.

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Of course they're hypocrites, they're Christians.

I've never met an non-hypocritical Christian.

Religious fundamentalists are worthless trash, trying to destroy our civil society from within. They want to turn America into the Christian version of Iran.

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Why limit it?

Suldog
http://jimsuldog.blogspot.com

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.

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Adam, please insert facebook (and other social media). I need to "like" this post!

/serious

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You don't see a Facebook "like" button at the bottom of the original post - next to the links for Twitter, etc.? If not, let me know (along with the browser you use) and I'll see what's going on.

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Standing on the street with a sign doing God's work, pretty much a lost cause for reasoning with. Its not now and never was about saving the unborn, its about pointing and shaming others to make yourself feel righteous.

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Please. You deign to read people's minds and know what they truly feel? You're either a fool or you're as self-righteous and belittling of others as you maintain they are.

If you want to reason with people, you have to start by being reasonable yourself.

Suldog
http://jimsuldog.blogspot.com

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Forgive them, for they no not what they do?

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Let he who is without sin cast the first stone. Mea Culpa, and all that. But I'll reference my comment above, about having never met a human being who wasn't a hypocrite, and acknowledge that I certainly intended that to mean I'm included.

Suldog
http://jimsuldog.blogspot.com

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Mind reading is not required when the subject holds up a sign and shouts at strangers, they're going out of their way to let you know what they're thinking.

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What is on the signs is obvious, yes. But you made a value judgment. You said that it isn't about what was on the signs, but that they had an entirely different agenda, one of getting their kicks from self-righteousness. While that is certainly a possibility, you have no way of knowing whether that is actually the case (outside of either being a mind reader or having those people stating to you that they are out to get kicks via being self-righteous, either of which is a highly doubtful scenario.)

Suldog
http://jimsuldog.blogspot.com

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as are pretty much all of the people involved with the "Pro-life" movement. As a woman who's adamently pro-choice, I think it's disgusting that these people are allowed to bully people in the street, especially during an extremely vulnerable time in their life, it's none of their business, or anybody else's business, for that matter, whether a woman decides to terminate an unwanted pregnancy for whatever reason. The right to choose is and must be kept as a right.

Kudos to the woman's husband for confronting those women. They needed to be told off!

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Aaron - I am sorry that you and your wife have had to go thru this. But I do also want to say thank you for what you did. IT took a lot of courage to deal with those 2 with such calm. I do not think I would have done the same.

White men should not be able to tell me or any other woman what to do with their body. No one knows what someone who has to make this decision by themsleves or with their loved ones is going through. It's no one's business but those who it affects.

The only way to stop or greatly reduce abortion is proper s_ex EDUCATION. And that doesn't mean abstinance only. A well rounded s_ex ed that includes CORRECT information abut safe s_ex, std's, birth control, etc as well as abstinence is what is needed. But pro-lifers don't want that either.

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You can say "sex" here. You're among friends.

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excellent...sex, sex, sex!

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"White men should not be able to tell me or any other woman what to do with their body."

So you're ok with Asian men, or white women, or multiracial people of indeterminate gender, telling you what to do with your body?

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Those protestors are awful, terrible human beings for thinking that what they are doing is right, especially when this man is telling them how much they hurt his wife, who is already going through one of the worst things a woman can have to deal with.

Aaron, if you ever read this, I applaud you for standing up to these two vile people. And I'm terribly sorry that you and your wife had to deal with such abuse when you were already hurting. That you used logic with these people instead of just insulting them makes you a far better person than I could have been.

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Since this is a moral issue it really isn't something that should be argued about. I agree that those ladies were making a traumatic experience more traumatic, no matter what the reason. However, because anti/pro abortion is a question of morality it should be left alone. You cannot convince someone else of changing their morals(without a lot of work). And since the opposite groups in this debate are so large their is no obvious way to resolve it. I'm appalled that congress spends anytime debating this as they are supposed to debate on fundamental law, not moral issues. When congress begins debating on the sentence time for abortion doctors commiting murder, without first coming to the conclusion that abortion is murder, you know we have lost track.

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