The Crimson reports:
Flyers Under Students' Doors Say 'No Fucking Jews'
We're seeing what happens when you suppress any dialog or speech critical of Jewish society or Israel as "anti-semitism" or "hate speech":
You're left with the only voices being from people who don't care if it's hate speech or antisemitism.
Further, the people who were moderate end up resenting your silencing them, which pushes them away from a moderate, reasoned attitude to one of hatred - if only because you're silencing them.
No, this has nothing to do with Israel, anymore than it would have in 1939 - or for that matter, 1339. The only difference is they're not throwing Jews down wells or just rounding them up anymore.
Ur zionism is showing
Who is suppressing "any dialog or speech critical of Jewish society or Israel"? I've seen plenty of speech, that has not been suppressed, critical of Israel and their treatment of Palestinians, from Jews and non-Jews alike.
Also, remember that "speech critical of Jewish society" can pretty quickly get to "anti-Semitism" if you're not careful. It's one thing to criticize a state's action. It's another to criticize a whole society, as if it's a monolithic organization, especially if you are not a member of said society and don't actually know much about it. At a certain point, it just starts to sound like you have a bone to pick with that society, rather than any actual criticism that is at all constructive.
So, who is this nebulous "you" who is silencing everyone, anyhow?
Not in the American mainstream media.
The flyers strike me as a fairly crude and ill-considered swipe at the exclusivity and biases of the actual finals clubs.
This isn't a real club that's excluding Jews, right?
It's commentary on the clubs that don't come out and say this in their flyers but, instead, may practice it.
Harvard's just too nuanced for me.
If you are a Jew and you are offended, you need a non-jew to decide whether or not it is REALLY anti-semitic and give you permission to be offended!
Just like, if you are a member of a minority group and you call out racism, you aren't allowed to do so with out the express consent and agreement by a white person.
Similarly, it isn't sexism unless a male agrees and gives you permission to call it that.
See also "mansplaining", "whitesplaining" and "goysplaining".
Astrophysics uses the term "black hole" to describe an object so massive and dense that nothing ever escapes from its gravitational field, not even light.
If you are frustrated dealing with a bureaucratic organization because they're always asking for information and forms but they never respond to questions or requests for information, and you use the term "black hole" to describe the organization...
... and some ignorant person construes this as a racist comment and takes offense...
then whitesplaining my arse, you have committed no sin and you don't owe anyone an apology or a retraction.
It's not always up to the "victim" to define the terms of the dialogue.
Wow, it makes so much more sense when you explain it in terms of an absurd situation that would never actually happen.
Well, not for the last couple years at least.
I asked where the anti-semitism. It my not have been clear that I think the finals clubs are indeed of a bastion of anti-semitism and much bigotry in general.
And I'm Jewish, so uh, yeah, I can actually decide when I don't think something is NOT anti-Semitic and I think everyone, except anti-Semites, can.
Or shouldn't be, anyways. He's certainly entitled to his opinion.
The question is whether the headline is accurate.
I would say no.
Sorry to be snippy, but there's not a huge amount of 'nuance' necessary here. These were clearly satirical, anti-finals club flyers - meant to portray the clubs as patronizingly bigotted. The article points out that flyers with similar intent (although apparently not as satirical) were slipped under doors for each of the last two years.
Harvard final clubs have been off and on controversial since at least the early 80s. Not really anything new here.
(Btw, the best part of the article is where the president of the Harvard Lampoon was questioned by the administration and "adamantly said his organization had nothing to do with the flyers, which he said were 'basely crass' in a tone inconsistent with the Lampoon’s style of 'pretentiously crass' humor.")
No, this is anti-Semitism. Bad behavior by clubs is also anti-Semitism. To paraphrase Oprah, "You're an anti-Semite. And you're an anti-Semite! Everyone is an anti-Semite."
For the record, I am Jewish of Israeli descent by way of escaping the Holocaust. The first thing I did when reading this news was reminding myself when Kristallnacht happened because I mis-remembered that it was on 11/29 (it was 11/9 - 11/10). I haven't had to experience the type of anti-Semitism my grandparents did, but the memories are still potent enough that any type of anti-Jewish sentiment is very scary.
I disagree that this is anti-semitism. If you can't allow for irony and sarcasm as commentary then that damns alot of people. It makes Randy Newman pretty vile-- racist, northern-ist, imperialist, height-ist....
I think it is a valid way to criticize, it's the people who don't laugh that we need to be wary of
Satire doesn't come into play here. In fact, if you think this is amusing in any way, I think you nwe'd to examine your own beliefs.
I disagree with that too.
Anyone who believes they have the right to set the parameters of another person's sense of humor is an asshole.
Let's say someone produces a movie, and the movie contains a character whose words and actions are clearly anti-Semitic: let's say the character is some kind of neo-nazi skinhead.
And lets also say that the movie portrays this character in an extremely unsympathetic light: it makes him out to be a crude, hateful, and not-very-bright barbarian.
In fact, what if the entire point of the movie is that guys like that are scum?
Would you call that an "anti-Semitic movie?" Would you describe the movie as expressing anti-Jewish sentiment?
A crude satire directed against final clubs, not against Jews.
I totally read this wrong the first time... as in Jews shouldn't get any sex. yikes ;-)
If these fliers were dropped in South Boston the attorney general and and every media outlet would be doing stories on how southie is racist and anti semetic.
At Harvard this is an intellectual prank in Southie this would be considered Hate Speech.
The number of fake 'hate' crimes is getting ridiculous. And if I'm wrong [I don't think I am], my sincerest apologies.
Anyone know what happened to the Jewish dude in NYC who was mad at his family and neighbors about something, so he started posting antisemitic graffiti over the neighborhood? Seriously, authorities have to really crack down hard on people who do this kind of stuff.
Seriously, "I don't get it," as in "I literally don't understand," not as a rhetorical device.
Someone distributes a flyer that slams the Harvard clubs for their anti-semitism, and the flyer itself is deemed anti-semitic?
In what way does the flyer disparage, ridicule, belittle, or insult Jews?