Hey, there! Log in / Register
Support Universal Hub
Help keep Universal Hub going. If you like what we're up to and want to help out, please consider a (completely non-deductible) contribution.
Help keep Universal Hub going. If you like what we're up to and want to help out, please consider a (completely non-deductible) contribution.
Comments
Conley's position is a
Conley's position is a perfect compromise: a casino only passes if both our City as a whole and East Boston say yes. It shows we are one City. Personally, I like the idea of creating a new innovation district on the 163 acres of Suffolk Downs property instead of a casino, which Conley suggests in today's Globe. Glad to see someone take a leadership position on this issue.
Wrong on this one
I like Dan Conley. I was leaning his way. But I think he's out of touch on this one and I will have to reassess. How is it a perfect compromise when the possibility exists that East Boston could vote No and the rest of the City could vote Yes? The neighborhood that will be most impacted gets a Casino while West Roxbury or Hyde Park get none of the impact but all of the benefit from whatever windfall the City reaps. How many people do you think will be driving down Metropolitan Ave in Roslindale to get to Suffolk Downs? Oh, and alll of a sudden we are one City. Please. Did East Boston get a say on the massive Harvard Expansion into Allston and Brighton? Did anyone ask East Boston about the development of the South Boston Waterfront? Nobody cared about our opinion on the Biolab. For all that East Boston endures already on this little island, this should be our choice and ours only. Innovation District? Fantastic idea but making that a reality takes more than a cool name and a magic wand.
It ONLY passes if both the
It ONLY passes if both the Ward and City vote yes. Any other combination (Ward says Yes, City says No, etc.) is a No. Your scenario would not occur if the City Council adopts Conley's policy.
The policy would apply equally to the East Boston case and any future casino proposals if Conley becomes Mayor (so if Eastie fails, maybe proposals will come for Southie or Allston - Brighton).
Not even an option
The vote is either Ward Only or Citywide at the option of the Council per the law as written. Period. There is no option that you describe and let's not kid anyone that the City Council can tinker with it. If the City as a whole were to vote, and it passes, then that's the vote regardless of whether East Boston precincts all voted 100% against. Does that change your thinking a bit? I know it has for people on both sides of the issue over here. A local only ballot question is probably the ONLY thing proponents and opponents agree on.
I guess when people who describe themselves as progressives (read: Sonia Chang Diaz) start caring about what I have to say on issues like Whole Foods coming to Jamaica Plain for example, then I will gladly welcome their input on what happens on McLellan Highway. Until then ...
Other Casino proposals if Conley becomes Mayor? What other proposals? I didn't realize Conley was also running for Mayor of Everett or Springfield because I suspect that's likely to be where one ends up if it isn't in Boston. I can only assume you just started paying attention to this issue.
Chill out
I read it the same way - that the vote should have to pass BOTH Eastie AND citywide. I'm not saying that's how the law reads right now (and I don't think it does), but the proposal the candidates are making is that it should have to pass both smell tests. The council might not have much sway, but a new mayor might. Even if they can't change it, it's interesting to hear their opinions about these issues.
When is this vote anyway? Will the new mayor have a possible say in changing this or is it a fait accompli? All these elections have me very confused. I just voted in one, there's another one coming up, there's another one for us in June and then the prelims in September and a municipal election in November. I may need to change my occupation from finance to "full time voter".
No more bets please
So Suffolk Downs would be required to win an East Boston only AND a citywide vote accordingly to Conley. I'm on the fence on this issue (leaning pro) but talk about stacking the deck against the applicant. How is that even fair. Its like picking the daily double! If its going to be the entire City voting then a win is a win I say. Not so sure that is good for East Boston though.
I think the working theory
I think the working theory here is that the liberal sensibilities of the Back Bay/Beacon Hill/Jamaica Plain/West Roxbury neighborhoods would counteract whatever pro-casino sentiments might exist within the political machine of Eastie, thereby preventing a casino from being approved.
Conley is anti-casino and he obviously isn't confident that East Boston voters are going to reject it on their own.
District
District Attorneys/Prosecuters are good at what they do, Newman Flanagan, Francis X Bellotti were both DA's and both ran for higher state office positions and both lost. DA'S are always going to be known for prosecuting criminals, not running a city!
What about Harvard Grad John
What about Harvard Grad John Connolly , does he also want a city wide vote on Casino, if not, He will be Eastie's chosen candidate for Mayor. Instead of these 2 "Stiffs".
Here's an idea!
The formal, binding vote gets held in East Boston, at the same time as a city-wide vote. If the local vote comes out no, any neighborhood that voted "yes" in the city-wide vote is considered to already have supported a casino, if sufficient property can be found there.
wrong on this one Pt.2
just like when the Social Jerk offs were trying to tell Southie that a new Patriots Stadium would be good for them. Thank God Jimmy Kelly and Billy Bulger was there to stand up for the residents.
Wow, this is the start of a
Wow, this is the start of a war on the Casino, & its going to get ugly, mayoral candidates who are for the city wide vote on Casino, are all envy that the a Casino won't be in there neighborhood, "envy" if in fact Eastie gets the Green light for Casino, Eastie will get millions of dollars from Casino owners to pave roads , expanded local school programs, and many other related neighborhood issues, Did Eastie residents vote on the mammouth Home Depot store in West Roxbury! Which provides jobs for W Roxbury residents, put it this way, in 5 years, you will see celebrities, movie stars, famous singers, comedians at the New Suffolk Downs Casino in East Boston.
I like this proposal. It
I like this proposal. It gives Eastie a specific voice but doesn't shut out the rest of the city, and the rest of the city can't essentially force the acceptance of a casino on Eastie in the event they vote it down and vice versa.
Kinda ironic
So someone in West Roxbury (14 mi away by car) would get to vote on the casino, but someone right down the street in Chelsea or Revere would not?
Sort of
Revere will (part of Casino property is in Revere). Winthrop, however, who shares roads and impacts and is closer to Suffolk Downs than the North End, gets no vote.
Town dumps
Why do you think town dumps are always on a town line? ;-)
Must allow entire city
I'm all for the city voting.
If we let just East Boston vote on things where do you think Logan Airport would be located today?
Well, that site had been an
Well, that site had been an airfield anyway, and then massive expansion hit in the 60's and 70's and created some weird parts of Eastie that are trapped or cut in half. That expansion took a big swath of housing away from the area and really messed up the neighborhood feel in that part of Eastie. So, yeah, W Rox does not need to deal with any negative externalities caused by this being built, so I feel that their say should be weighted. I do like the idea of having Eastie vote first. But you have to be ignorant or stupid to say that this casino will do anything to the far out neighborhoods in the city, maybe some 93 traffic, but that's basically all I can think of.
Who pays
for all the police, fire, inspectional services, schools for the employees' kids, parks and recreation for same and so on. What happens if the whole thing turns out to be revenue negative when all these impacts are netted out - I'd say it would then have some pretty significant impacts on the rest of the city.
Well that's like saying that
Well that's like saying that any store/bar/nightclub should be voted on by the city, since that diverts city money to different areas of town. If you want to break it down by allocation, I'm all for it, and I see your point (and agree to a certain extent). I personally am conflicted as to whether or not this should even be here at all, but that's a different story for a different thread.
Residents don't actually get
Residents don't actually get a vote on what is open or gets built in the city or their own neighborhood. Most of that goes through the zoning board. Residents may attend hearings and give input, but in the end, there is almost never a vote of residents to give approval or not. So all of these analogies commenter are making about East Boston not getting a vote things like on the West Roxbury Home Depot are moot. This is not how it normally works. Holding a referendum to approve the Host Community Agreement with a developer to build a casino is something specifically written into the process of getting one of the licenses to establish a casino.
Personally I'm kind of annoyed with the mayor's suggestion (and the mayor) to limit the referendum to only one neighborhood. It does impact the entire city both positively and negatively. The entire city benefits from job creation and revenue, not just East Boston. The entire city bears whatever impact of a casino would have on public resources, crime, and traffic. East Boston doesn't exist in a bubble.
How will Crime at the Casino
How will Crime at the Casino impact residents of West Roxbury (Chestnut hill) and Hyde Park (Dedham) which are miles apart, In any case, this can create more jobs for city of Boston, probably be a high demand for second Boston Police station in Orient Heights area, a rapid response police force will be needed close by for crowd control at Casino, also Revere Police dept. would have to increase their patrols, this creates job growth for entire city of Boston and Revere.It will also create needed revenue for cash strapped mbta, ridership will be up on the blue line, which means more mbta trains would have to be built, which creates more mbta jobs .
East Boston does not benefit
East Boston does not benefit from any of the Development that's been going on at the South Boston Waterfront! I'm positively sure that millionaire developers Fallon's , Fish corp , Farina corp. Etc. have donated millions to South Boston causes and neighborhood programs, Those businesses on South Boston waterfront are part of the South Boston chamber of commerce, lots of donated money from these hotels resturaunts from waterfront is making Southie a better place to reside in. East Boston waited 2 decades to see a waterfront come in to fruition. Suffolk Downs has been a Mecca for gambling in Mass for 80 years, all of a sudden mayoral candidates want to put an end to it all, all because of how much attention Eastie will receive and all the thousand who will visit from around the world.
yeah, those developments generate no taxes
all the money spent in the waterfront, which generates taxes that benefit East Boston.
Suffolk downs has been hardly a "Mecca" of gambling. Ever been in there? Its a dump.
Casinos in th elong run will be bad for the city both socially and economically, why shouldnt the whole city have a say?
Polls?
Any sense on how the city as a whole is leaning? Are the registered voters of the City of Boston pro-casino, anti-casino...?
I'm admittedly not a Boston resident, but
if I were, I'd be anti-casino, because casinos are the last thing that Boston needs for the creation of more jobs and more revenue coming into the city. Boston doesn't need to become another Atlantic City or Mohegan Sun. If I was a Boston resident, that's how I'd feel, and vote.