Important People not going to let the hoi polloi stand in the way of their Olympics
Eric Wilbur reports that 100 of our Most Important People held soirees at the MIT Media Lab and the Gardner yesterday to convince the US Olympic Committee that Boston's the best place to hold the 2024 Olympics.
What? You didn't know? No, of course not, you don't think they'd want you to know, do you? He reminds us about the promises of public meetings on the Olympics bid. You know, the public meetings that never got held. Maybe they're afraid Louise Day Hicks will rise from the grave and do what she did to the 1976 World's Fair proposal.
Meanwhile, the Dorchester Reporter talks with people who own companies in Widett Circle, where the Masters of the Massachusetts Universe want to put an Olympic Stadium. Seems the companies all own their own property, they employ 700 people in that supposed no-man's land and they don't want to sell or move. Eminent domain, anyone?
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Comments
Baker
I would imagine that Baker is probably not pleased that Patrick is trying to get this ball rolling so fast that by the time he gets into office he won't be able to slow it down (if that is what he wanted to do, no guarantee there).
I love when elected officials
I love when elected officials, elected by the public in public elections, do something that a person doesn't like, and suddenly the public is "shut out." Sorry, that's how representative democracy works. Just because you didn't get your way doesn't mean theres been some corruption of the system.
They're running an end around
They're running an end around passed us by only talking to the people we elected after a long drawn out election process and have the ability to vote for again or against every few years! HOW DARE THEY THIS IS A DEMOCRACY!
Bob DeLeo
The State House isn't even going to vote on this. In fact, we're just replacing the Treasurers Office with the IOC. We're doing this because it's all a big conspiracy led by the power hungry Team Handball Cabal.
It is refreshing how you
It is refreshing how you think that Baker is suddenly a grassroots populist who will yank his leash out of the hands of his corporate masters.
Baker
has come out against using tax dollars to fund the bid. Then again, so has everybody in office. Otherwise it's the "I need to look over the bid before I can make a decision" standpoint. If anything, I'd venture Baker would rather have Patrick accelerate the process, so that if it goes to shit, Baker can shift the ire onto the previous administration.
OLYMPICS
You mean the Hoi Aristoi.
No, those are the people who want it
Not to be confused with the common folk, who just don't understand how vitally important the Olympics are to making Boston a WORLD CLASS CITY.
Why do we need to be a world class city?
(Expletive) that. I like us the way we are. I'm okay with having some things without having everything. It's called the middle (expletive) class. Weird concept, I know.
Too late
Boston is world class, not in everything - but no city is.
Other than lots more people - what do other cities have that we don't. Volume doesn't make you world class. Hell - as much as we complain about our pols - even they are better than a lot of other dysfunctional holes in the ground that are lots bigger than us. (that's not an endorsement pols!)
The Olympics needs volume - we don't have that kind of volume. Leave it to the Londons, New Yorks, Chicagos, LAs, Tokyos, Beijings etc. for that. I'm happy being like us, DC, SF (yes I know they are in the running too), Amsterdam, Cape Town, Auckland, Kyoto and more. I've been to all those smaller cities which are world class in their own way and I'll take them over volume any day.
Vancouver
Boston is a pretty good analog for Vancouver really, but they had a Winter Olympics which is a much more manageable affair (and still a stupid waste of money).
As a recent SF transplant
I agree with everything you said. The Olympics in SF or Boston would be nearly as stupid and way more expensive as when SF hosted the World Cup a couple of summers ago. Nowhere near the "promised" revenue was generated, promised fundraising targets were not met by half (I believe) and of course, who was on deck to pick up the check? Hint: Not Larry Ellison, 6th richest man in the world whose team was racing!
Huh? World Cup in San Francisco??
The USA has hosted only one World Cup, in 1994. It was played in stadiums all over the US -- including pre-Gillette Foxboro Stadium and Stanford Stadium, but not anywhere in San Francisco.
He meant Sailing not soccer
He meant Sailing not soccer
America's Cup
Sailboats.....
Boston -> Gillette is just
Boston -> Gillette is just about the same distance as SF -> Stanford Stadium. Yes, it's not "in" the city, but it's in the metro and not really very far away.
Also, Giants Stadium wasn't "in" New York, the Rose Bowl isn't "in" Los Angeles and the Silverdome isn't "in" Detroit.
Welcome to Boston!
Always glad to see Bostonians who are from the West Coast!
You bring a fresh new perspective on things.
- The Original SoBo Yuppie
Bostonians who are from the
I know that you know this is a logical fallacy. Just needed to register disapproval, carry on.
Chicago lost the olympics
Chicago lost the olympics recently, which is a good thing for our faire city, hopefully.
Perhaps not
Here is jconway, who worked on Chicago's losing Olympic bid, talking about how that experience relates to Boston.
Hoi Polloi, meet Stylebook
Some pedants (myself included) will say that The Hoi Polloi is like ATM Machine. Others differ.
From the Wikipedia Article:
I came here just to see if
I came here just to see if anyone else had already pointed this out. Carry on.
Well we speak English and not
Well we speak English and not ancient Greek so your over-correction actually makes you look stupid.
Thank you
Harvard and MIT both have pretty respectable linguistics departments; with that insight you might see if you could get onto their calendars as a visiting speaker.
John Fish - 617-445-3500
Be fair warned I will work tooth and nail to get this thing stopped.
I don't care about Team Handball or Judo or Weightlifting.
I don't want to be told that I cannot walk down Clarendon Street because the showdown between Thailand and Brunei for the Women's Badminton Bronze Medal Match will be played at Matthews Arena six hours from now.
I was told as part of the Big Dig that the Green Line Extension would be built. That was 1992. Don't tell me you are going to built it now for me as part of an Olympic sweetner
I don't want to watch another rehash of the Big Dig with Staties being paid to sit in cars while someone digs a hole on a dead end street.
I don't want the suburban cop in the city mentality of NEMLEC walking around in full riot gear and checking my id when I try to get on the Hingham Ferry. "Did the Vineyard Vines shirt and khakis make me look out of the ordinary officer? Does my doughy pasty Irish face look out of place here?"
I don't want the Sox to have to do a 4 week road trip while Fenway is used for batting practice by Coca Cola Execs. and whatever Sepp Blatterequse jackarses are running the IOC.
I went through East London a few months back, you know the place that was to be revitalized with the 2012 Olympics. It still looks like the area Commercial Street in Malden south of Malden Center stretching over to the Edison plant in Everett, only worse.
No Boston Olympics.
+1,000
I'd have clapped out loud reading this if I didn't think it would startle the sleeping cat on my lap and send me to the Band-Aid drawer.
In all fairness,
Handball is a pretty great sport.
Worth bringing the Olympics to town? - obviously not.
2 Cents
Speaking as a business person who lived through the Democratic National Convention I must agree with you completely. Even Sail Boston was a joke.
Every time they do something and promise hundreds of thousands of dollars in the hands of local business it turns into a cluster fu** of epic proportions.
They love the trickle down effect. Put all the money in our friends pockets and if it trickles down, then great.
The problem is it does not trickle, drip, leak or anything. It just hurts.
You haven't figured that out?
They use a wrench to open up the floodgates - and fill their swimming pool. then they drop the wrench on your head.
Bravo
Well said, John.
All good points. Adding to
All good points. Adding to that--
Don't make it easy
OK, slight thread drift....
I voted YES on Q1 because the last thing I want is to make our reps jobs any easier when it comes to collecting revenues. The automatic raise of the tax is just pure laziness on their part. If you want money - just ask for it. If it gets refused, too bad - try again. But you need to go thru the process.
Besides, that's just a weak argument.
Back to our scheduled programming....
It repealed inflation indexing. Period.
They still have plenty of work to stay busy, don't worry, but now they are hamstrung when planning necessary, unavoidable repair projects because we have no way assure the gas tax, earmarked for those repairs, will keep up with the cost of the repairs. It was a struggle anyway, now it's impossible.
So they get to waste time digging in the sofa cushions for money that must be spent anyway, unless road and bridge repair becomes a low priority for anyone.
Then you do what you always do
I know that. And that's what I voted against - the automatic increases.
You present a bill to appropriate X amount of dollars for said projects. Just like everything else.
My argument was no automatic increases. That's just laziness.
Counter Talking Point
It would be far simpler and easier and CHEAPER to simply draw up a plan of transit improvements, and require that they be done FIRST. Then we can start talking about maybe holding the Olympics.
Great post.
Does anyone know of any current petitions against this? I know about this effort:
www.nobostonolympics.org
I'm not sure that alone can prevent this though.
Tide come in, tide goes out,
Tide come in, tide goes out, Adam links hype click bait about the Olympics.
Tides wash things, too
Too bad there are no bleached anon bones on the shore of this drive-by nonsense.
Stadium in Widett Circle
Would mean that it would be much harder for restaurants to get food. Do people go out to eat when they come to the Olympics? Not for BOSTON 2024!
S'okay
None of those restaurants are going to have the money to be Olympic Sponsors anyway, so they don't matter. You'll understand that the Patriotic Thing To Do is eat at McDrano's, because they are an Olympic Sponsor, and every time they sell a Pink Slimeburger, they donate a tenth of a mill to the US Olympic team, Hoo-Rah!
Of course, if you have reservations about any of this, you're free to exercise your right to Free Speech on Beacham Street in Chelsea, between 6 and 7 am. No banners with the word 'Olympic,' though.
Widett Circle
Is completely unsuited to an 80,000 seater. It won't go there, it's just a placeholder that doesn't offend anybody in the neighborhood where the actual stadium would go if this nonsense comes to pass. You're right, you'd have to kick on the wholesalers, negotiate an astronomical price with the Cold Storage company who's already threatening a recycling center unless the MBTA buys the property, deck over portions of the Southampton Yard and t Track 61 and the Fairmount Line, solve the transfer station bottlenecks downtown considering Broadway/Andrew and South Cove are the closest stops, wedge this stupid little BCEC pet-DMU project in which is likewise nearly impossible to do and get decent service from it - Widett won't work, they'll bail for something else, but where is anyone's guess.
History (and the Globe) repeats itself
Included in the documents related to the Expo '76 you link to is this bon mot from the Boston Globe, writing a post mortem:
Yeah, and Boston never recovered, right?
(The only part of the Expo that I would have supported was the use of monorails!)
The irony of the bon mot
In the end, it was the federal government (or at least a federal court) that made sure the harbor was cleaned up, but the federal government ended up paying very little of the tab.
Expo/World's fair is more of
Expo/World's fair is more of a celebration of a community rather than the Olympics which is just a city playing host. There's also that tab being picked up by the Federal govt - not the same with Olympics.
Of course, look at what an Expo did to Montreal. and that park in Queens.
I love the idea that not
I love the idea that not having a public meeting this immediate minute is a sign of some conspiracy to block public input. Because evidently some guy (unknown who) said it would be too late to back out soon? Prove it. The games would be for a decade. Prove why we cant back out after this meeting. Then complain about your conspiracy. Until then, quit the hysterics. You sound worse than BDC. Seriously, you sound ridiculous.
Bare minimum, if the state is
Bare minimum, if the state is in fact on the line for any money (Fish says we wouldn't be), the state house would have to approve the budget item and the budget. That's BARE. MINIMUM. Realistically, we're in for months of Town Hall Meetings, epic speeches on the House floor, and other myriad of ways to grand stand. So again, public input. Seriously, people act like the IOC is going to run some sort of Oceans 11 operation into the Treasurer's Office and steal money next week? Get a grip.
Horse after cart
Once the USOC and then the IOC pick Boston, it's kind of too late for public discussion. There's no way we're going to turn this thing down and then what happens when the private group decides, oops, they were wrong, they can't put up all their money.
Also, Fish has been upfront in saying the project is going to need several billion dollars worth of infrastructure improvements - you don't think he's going to pay for that T upgrade we keep getting promised , do you? Where is that money going to come from? Are we discussing that now? No, we're not.
The infrastructure
The infrastructure improvements are all things the legislature has bought and paid for, AKA things happening whether or not we get the Olympics. Just on the T alone we're already:
1) Redoing the Type 7 Green Line cars (actually almost done)
2) Buying new Red and Orange Line cars
3) Running 3 car sets on the Green Line
4) Resignalling all the lines
5) Street Light Prioritization for the Green Line
6) Purchasing DMU cars
7) Expanding the Indigo Line project to other lines
8) Building infill stations on the new Indigo Lines
ALL BOUGHT AND PAID FOR REGARDLESS OF THE OLYMPICS.
In any case, you think there's no way we could back out paying for things after the USOC and IOC picks us? That's insane. The money is allocated by the state house with a veto from the governor. You think they'd all just say, "well, we want to say no, but they did pick us so our hands are tied!" What has Bob DeLeo, Charlie Baker, Therese Murray, or anyone on Beacon Hill ever done to make you think that would happen in a million years?
How much of this has happened?
1) Redoing the Type 7 Green Line cars (actually almost done)
These are mostly 25-year-old cars overdue for their mid-life overhaul. Let's not pat anyone on the back for doing something that should have been done 5 years ago. Give kudos to whoever selected the contract for these cars in the early '80s, they have been a good procurement.
2) Buying new Red and Orange Line cars
Funded, yes. But won't start delivery for five years.
3) Running 3 car sets on the Green Line
Sometimes, but this was a minor infrastructure/capacity upgrade which is hamstrung by stupid policies (no off-board fare collection, no signal priority).
4) Resignalling all the lines
Have they been? The Red Line could use moving blocks so a train doesn't have to wait at Kendall until the next train is clear of Park.
5) Street Light Prioritization for the Green Line
Ha! This would be nice, by someone driving a Benz in Brookline might have to wait longer at a red light.
6) Purchasing DMU cars
Again, in theory this might happen in the next 10 years. In practice, I'm not holding my breath.
7) Expanding the Indigo Line project to other lines
Yes, the stations on the Fairmont Line are expanded, and there's even weekend service coming with hourly headways (something no other line can boast). However, there is no linked transfer to the Red Line at South Station without a monthly 1A pass (so you can't use a Charlie Card), the trains run hourly during the day, nowhere near subway frequency (20 minute headways would be marginal), the trains are run with push-pull commuter sets for minimum acceleration and maximum local air quality impacts (never occurred to anyone to run a wire between Readville and Southie because that might give good service), stations have minimal facilities (other than ADA accessibility and nice platforms) and the neighborhoods will probably fight any nearby development tooth and nail any because parking.
8) Building infill stations on the new Indigo Lines
The new Indigo Lines, which haven't been build. Let's not put the cart too far before the horse.
Beat me to the punch
Let's make a clarification that funding is not execution, it's still up the MBTA to implement these projects. They've been reticent even with funding because they don't want to add to their operating costs post-construction.
Now this isn't the thread (at least not yet) to get sidetracked by a transit discussion, but I love this stuff so I'll bite. I'm with that most of these line items are well on their way to fruition (Type 7 rehabs, new OL/RL trainsets, etc...), but my worry is more what isn't here.
When I'm generous, I look at Indigo as an honest attempt by the MBTA to upgrade it's technology, develop a better transit corridor through Mattapan and Dorchester, and improve it's staid, "nothing new" image. When I'm cynical, I look at is as just another distraction to draw attention away from more useful, but politically complicated projects.
Indigo-ification is really only feasible on the Fairmount Line and only then after SSX. The MBTA could, without much difficult, expand current Fairmount Line service without having to resort to new cars. DMUs are not rapid transit. They are subject to the same congestion that the CR is and there is no way around that. SSX will help, but DMUs are never going to run rapid transit headways. Add to this that each northside/southside line has its own unique qualities and DMUs will fit differently into each arrangement, i.e. most Northside lines can only really use the DMUs to fill in the cracks in service and even then, only off-peak. We can't start replacing CR push-pulls because DMUs (being subject to the same headway-limiting congestion) just don't have the proper capacity for most of those route. DMUs are absolutely not the panacea we think they are and I'm worried we're spending too much attention on something that isn't going to make an appreciable difference. Doubly-so with building new Indigo platforms, that shouldn't even be discussed until the rapid transit network reaches to Lynn, maybe Rozzie, and there's a BL-RL connector.
The latter is probably the single most important project that MBTA can undertake. The downtown transfer stations are crushed already, and only going to be more crushed when GLX, SSX, and the SBW build-out all come to town. The connector allows Cambridge-bound BL riders a chance to avoid the quad-station hellhole downtown, it allows Logan-bound Red line riders easy access to the airport, and downtown-bound a better, less crowded alternative. It would also finally connect Eastie to the most economically viable transit corridor in the State.
Looking at the list above, I would argue that the current CIP is evidence that we may need something like the Olympics to force the MBTA stick up for itself in the General Court and force local communities to start throwing their weight around to get better transit access.
Denver rejected the 1976 Winter Olympics after they were awarded
by voting them down in a 1972 referendum. The IOC had to start over and find a new location for them in Innsbruck, Austria.
Referendum
Is this something that could be put to voters in a referendum or ballot question? (from a legal/constitutional perspective)
I'm not saying that the powers that be would do this, but rather some citizens group or whatever could collect the signatures to get it on.
With respect to Olympics ,
With respect to Olympics , place it on some sort of ballot, like with the gambling rejected in East Boston.
Secondly , it ain't like it used to be. It is a staging area for the winners to get into the endorsement business with things like Wheaties ect. ( Bruce Jenner got some mileage , and got turbo-charged and brought us the new and improved Kashgrabians ) . There should be some sort of payback on these endorsement deals.
Thirdly , what he (Costello , J ) said ! ( except the part about Commercial street & Corporation Way , there was a lot of work that area one time , I banged some dockage over there , miss that type of America ) .
If there's a vote
on this, then everyone who works in Boston should be allowed to cast a ballot, even if they don't live in Boston. After all, if the Olympics somehow happen, it won't affect just the residents.
Not enough.
Expand it to surrounding communities. Traffic will be a nightmare with road closures.
If they opened the Olympics to a vote
America would never host another Olympics again. Because no one wants it, except maybe some podunk regions looking to improve its infrastructure at any cost.
Some podunk region …
Like Atlanta
Exactly
.
Widett Circle
I am in favor of anything that would stitch the South End, South Boston, and North Dorchester back together as one contiguous human-scale neighborhood. It would take a mega-scale project to do this given what exists in Widett/Newmarket right now, but it could be done as part of a stadium, whether it is for the Olympics or the Revolution or both (presumably the South End would demand some way of walking to the stadium without going a mile out of their way).
I believe there will be multiple elections where the general population will be given a voice to prevent the Olympics. I don't think its all that shocking that the USOC is more inclined to meet with proponents of the Olympics, but I'm pretty sure they can't actually dictate anything in the city or issue permits, they're just a panel offering an endorsement.
Back together?
That implies that these neighborhoods were together in the first place. The Newmarket area was an extension of the Fort Point Channel / South Bay i.e. mud flats until the turn of the century (map from 1900). By that point it had been crisscrossed by rail lines. It has always been a transportation and light industry zone, so while it might be possible to stitch these neighborhoods together, it wouldn't be back together, because they were never together in the first place.
So true
The South End and South Boston have never been joined, and South Boston and Dorchester were once so tenuously connected that Boston up and took Southie from Dorchester in 1804.
The reality is, the 3 areas have never been as connected as they are now, and IMHO we should be preserving our industrial side that is wedged in the area as best as possible.
Plus
We can't dance around the issue that cities absolutely need logistical, industrial centers like Newmarket. it's either that or a crush-load of delivery vans streaming in-and-out of the city every day. If we're going to talk about stitching neighborhoods back together then the two most obvious are South End-South Cove (cut off by the Pike extension and urban renewal of NY Streets and Castle Sq) and the South End-Roxbury (flattened for SWC and 695 - the South End-style street scape used to stretch as far west as Dudley Sq between Columbus and Albany )
That's true. But the city
That's true. But the city could do a lot more to make it pleasant to walk, bike, or take transit between the neighborhoods. (Putting in a stadium and its massive parking areas would have the opposite effect.)
What if you put the stadium in *without* parking areas?
Fenway Park doesn't have them, and it works well. Follow the precedent that it sets. Just make it pleasant and fun to walk to the Red Line.
Love the enthusiasm
Like the body snatchers, the pro-Olympics forces have gotten to the people at MIT
http://newsoffice.mit.edu/2014/3-questions-israel-ruiz-mit-boston-2024-o...
From Israel Ruiz, MIT’s executive vice president and treasurer:
Shorthand: "We're not going to bankrupt the city and state because, well, we're different and we know math."
I don't know why, but I do
I don't know why, but I do tend to trust the math expertise of Israel Ruiz, MIT professor over John Keith, Middling Quality Internet Commenter. But I'm sure you're right on this one.
Baaaah
I'll put my SAT scores up against his, any day of the week.
And, what's his IQ?
And, how fast can he run a marathon?
And if this had anything to do with math....
...you might have a point.
But it doesn't.
The elite academic
The elite academic intelligencia want something that brings transients and disregards the needs of people that have lived and worked here for years? You don't say????
These aren't the intelligencia
These are Administratia.
See also: sociopathic behavior in academic institutions
MIT relies on the stupidity of the American voter
Haven't you been paying attention this week?
Granted, when that fails, they just shove it down your throat.
disregard
E: Double, oops
F the olympics
F the IOC
F the plane they flew to Boston on
F their (redacted) Euro-accents
F their (redacted) shoes
F that technical school on the other side of the Charles River.
F the ruling 'Elite'
F pretentious, condescending mathematicians from that technical school on the other side of the Charles River.
F their boathouse
F whoever is involved in trying to bring the Olympics to this town.
ugh... just mega UGH
I'm just at a loss for words at this news. Actually I read the Boston Globe article (before I saw this on Uhuh) and my blood pressure rose alot.
I'm sorry, but three things are very clear now
1. We're going to get this whether we like it or not
2. The construction mafia... erm.. the construction industry lobby is far more powerful than we ever suspected. (But I don't think we're really surprised at this very much.)
3. Politicians will do whatever they feel like whether they have public support or not.
I just wish there was some way to stop this train wreck before its too late. Sadly, I don't think the amount of online petitions, or protests, or letter writing is going to stop this train wreck, the politicians are clearly committed to handing this to John Fish.
Sickening.. very sickening. Especially with the attitude like "We don't care what the tax payers think" that seems to be going on with these "private meetings".
*shakes head*
Agreed...
As much as I was sad to see Boston in my rear view mirror this past summer, while I drove a short 45 minutes to my new corner of the world in Amesbury, I can't help but feel that I got out just in time. I spent 8 awesome years in Boston, but came to realize that anyone who can not buy their way through life is being forced out of the city. The Olympics will crush Boston. Corruption, train wreck contruction projects, and traffic nightmares the likes of which we have never seen will run rampant. And as you said, they don't care to hear what the little guy has to say. Sure, they'll hold their town meetings and furrow their brows as if they're really interested in peoples' concerns, but at the end of the day they've already bought a seat at the table. Their own greed and self interest trumps all else.
Tell the IOC to stay away?
If enough Bostonians emailed, wrote or even called IOC and told them that they are as wanted to Godzilla's feces then perhaps they would get the message.
There was a post...
...a couple weeks back talking about some "entrepreneur" (the people who apparently run our society nowadays) saying, "It's only money", as if tax payer money spent to host the Olympics is akin to a sixteen year old stealing forty bucks from their dad's wallet. A commenter said something along the lines of "If the people with bottomless pockets want the Olympics in Boston, let them pay for it" (or something like that). I have to second those sentiments. Let all the "important" people get together and pool their money. Then they can put on the most lavish Olympic games in history. Just don't bother the rest of us working stiffs who couldn't care less.
Enhancement
Careful there Swirly
That's actually not that bad of an idea. You've got a largely undeveloped area, and a large area too. Build up rail connections from Boston and Worcester. Housing could be repurposed afterwards, which could ease housing costs in the area in the long run, along with opening the area up for more development, which I believe is the Devens mission statement.
This would be akin to what London was thinking with their Olympics.
Of course, this is predicated on getting some kind of high speed rail out to Devens. Not impossible, if you've got money burning a hole in your pocket or if we actually cared about infrastructure development.
I still have memories of the
I still have memories of the Ryder Cup at the Brookline CC jamming up traffic city wide.
Boston should be thinking about funding its crumbling transit system, repairing its schools, or even just fixing up its parks. Hosting the Olympics should not even be on its radar.
Marty Walsh on WBUR.
Today Mayor Marty Walsh stated: "Polling done in the city tells us a majority of residents are in favor of having the Olympics here.". This was around 12:55PM and he was responding to a caller who seems to be against the Olympics in Boston. I may have the quote off a little.
I don't remember having the ability to take a poll. Did any of you?
Someone misunderstands polls
Did you answer a phone survey between August and October about the governor's race?
An accurate poll doesn't need that many respondents, as long as there is a random quality to it, with perhaps a hook to make sure the sample is reflective of the population overall. If they surveyed 250 people, the results would be 97% accurate within a margin of error.
(I would have asked if you answered a survey about the mayor's race last year, but I think I was called a dozen times with polls on that one. My assumption is that everyone with a published landline got polled on that one. The oddest night what when I got polled on the governor's race. It was, well, refreshing.)
That said, whom did they poll, and what were the questions?