Citizen complaint of the day: And it's not even winter yet

A dismayed citizen reports on some winter-like behavior on Morrow Road in Brighton:

At least two residents on this street have been regularly using cones to save their spots. My roommate has been moving them and parking in the spots, but last night one of her tires was slashed. I know other people have been reporting these space savers and they just keep putting more out.

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Don't you just hate it ....

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... when people start putting up holiday decorations before Thanksgiving?
Space savers for double parking spots are reportedly already out on Broadway in South Boston.

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Reported by who? I live in

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Reported by who? I live in South Boston and have not seen that by residents. Maybe construction. Blah blah blah space savers blah blah blah South Boston. Soooooo oooooold.

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There is a special place in

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There is a special place in hell for the people putting space savers out in september. GFY kid

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Haha

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The joke's on you Kinopio. I am a proud space saver user (during and after snow storms) and I know from experience that the city will never remove a trash or recycling container. Never.

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This is what happens when you

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This is what happens when you have a thug mayor condoning the practice. Only a matter of time before someone gets killed over this nonsense. 'World Class' city my foot!

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3 people were shot on that street on one day this month alone

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And there have been more this year. Lot of guns and people quick to settle arguments with them on that street.

It's not really the best example of out-of-control space saver violence.

As someone who lives in Dot but doesn't use space savers it's really not that big of a deal. Seems like a lot of people outside the neighborhoods where it occurs have a lot more to say about it.

(Not you, necessarily, Kinopio. Don't know where you live.)

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Clarification: Violence and vandalism are big deals

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I reread my post and realized it may have seemed I was condoning that. I am not and I'm not pro-saver either. I don't use them. However, I firmly believe the media and online drama over space savers themselves is way out of proportion.

A person was stabbed to death, a couple streets over from here last week. The beef was over trash.
Neighbors beef over all kinds of stuff and vandalism does happen. Let's keep the space saver stuff in perspective.

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Yes

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Because this nonsense started only in 2013 and the mayor has expressly said that one can put a saver out 12 months a year. Also, it is never done in any other city, like, say, Chicago.

But sure, you can live in your world, and the rest of us can live in ours. That said, the only commonality is our worlds is that putting cones or whatnot out to save a spot on the street when there is no snow on the ground (or could even survive for an hour if trucked in) is not right.

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More on the situation

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Benjamin Barr reports:

i'm one of the other people who have been reporting this. i talked to this citizen on r/boston, and we are trying to find a good solution.

this has been going on for years (you can see it on google maps). for some reason this one tiny brighton street has given up on fighting it.

my blood boils every time i see those cones, but clearly we as residents can't do anything without fearing retribution.

the @BOS311 team has come and removed the cones at my request several times, but the jerk keeps putting them out.

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IDs to buy traffic cones!

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If I have to show an ID every time I buy some cold medicine (to make sure I'm not making tiny amounts of meth, apparently), they should have to show an ID to buy traffic cones!

(Seriously; I assume they keep stealing them. At what point do they steal enough it becomes grand larceny?)

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Traffic cones are a dime a dozen

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Traffic cones are a dime a dozen. You could probably walk up to any Eversource or National Grid truck, ask for a few and get them. If you worked there you could get dozens.

Solution is to remove the cones again, stake out the scene from an unmarked, non-police looking vehicle or from a house, then wait for tire-slasher. Hidden cameras are a good idea too. Wilful and malicious damage to a motor vehicle is a felony with consequences.

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Do tire slashers ...

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... ever consider that slashing someone else's tires so as to intimidate them into not parking in a certain spot and then parking there yourself might be setting yourself up for a retaliatory slashing?

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Yeah, I don't get it

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Even if it's not in front of the same house every time, if there is a serial saver in the neighborhood it should be very easy to figure out who it is

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Great! So..

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What're you gonna do about it?

I kinda wish I had a car I

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I kinda wish I had a car I didn't need for a while. Go park it there and get it slashed, and you know, just leave it with the flat tires. They did make the road Permit Only recently, but I bet I could get a junker and leave it there from November to April.

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Resident parking is morally

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Resident parking is morally equivalent to space saving. The difference is th city pays people to do the intimidation part for you.

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Been going on for years

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I lived at 15 Morrow Rd many years ago. The owners of the properties on either side marked their spaces year round. They were Brighton lifers and felt that gave them some sort of right to a parking space in front of their home, even though they have driveways. One side used cones and the other his garbage cans. One night we noticed someone had the temerity to move his trash cans and park in "his" space. Later we heard a commotion. The owner had come home and we watched him empty the trash onto the car and them toss the can onto the car. I suspect this poor person is dealing with the same characters. I would file a police report as I suspect they know exactly who would have done it based upon which spot was taken.

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There is only two solutions

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There is only two solutions to stopping these lazy entitled assholes. One is catching them in the act and getting them arrested. The other involves getting "creative" on your own. Hard to blame people for doing the later when maniac drivers get away with so much because cops do so little to stop them.

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What should we think?

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What should we think about a person who always calls those he disagrees with "assholes", not just on this post but frequently on a wide variety of subjects? Shall we assume it takes one to know one? Just asking.

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agreed (can't believe it), kinopio

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Obviously "extra-legal" measures should not be encouraged as the first response, but these people have made it clear they won't hesitate to vandalize peoples' property. If the city has failed to deal with it, I wouldn't exactly lose sleep if someone came up with their own solution.

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It's truly insane, and to

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It's truly insane, and to make matters worse the reason they save the spots on the street is because THEY TURNED THEIR DRIVEWAY INTO A SEATING AREA, complete with rockers and plants and all. The solution is right there but they are entitled as f***.

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You "would file a police report"...but did you?

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The owner had come home and we watched him empty the trash onto the car and them toss the can onto the car. I suspect this poor person is dealing with the same characters. I would file a police report...

When you saw your neighbor commit this act, did YOU file a police report back then?? Just wondering!

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Call the police!

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Putting up cameras is the best idea. Put signs on poles saying cameras are up.

The police should be notified. Maybe you will get lucky and the police will drive by when the coners are at work.

Talk to all of the neighbors.

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Better yet

Get a bunch of buddies and put something there that is too heavy for one person to move.

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I mostly loved living in City Point, but the street parking

madness really diminished our quality of life there. Had I understood how odious dealing with it was beforehand, I never would have gotten a place without off-street parking, but that's a tough find there. Moved back to the South End, which rightly bans spaces savers: they are a pox on civilized city living.

Still dearly miss having Castle Island close, though, such a joy to walk or run it nearly every day. A shame.

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castle island

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Walking out to and around Castle Island from City Point is delightful this time of year. The summer crowd is mostly gone. Being car free in City Point and not dealing with parking issues is the best! Double cheeseburger, a hot dog and some fries please!

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I'm convinced

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U-hub has four seasons: Storrow, Spacesaver, Bike Lane, and Stenographer output.

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uh

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the season for Properly Indexed and Digitized Stenographic Records of City Council Proceedings is year-round, bub.

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Fill the space

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Put more things in the space. Stinky things. Huge things. Heavy things. Unmovable things.

Slime the ground with something sticky and difficult to remove from asphalt. Dump a few dozen bags of sand in it.

Scorched earth policy. Make him give up first.

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This happened routinely

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In northeast Philly where I grew up, and it was just a thing people did on any old day of the week. Pretty sure it never made the news.

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Then you came to UHub

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Where this is HUGE news.

I guess we'll never be as world class as Philly (a city I have sadly only visited once and really loved)

Along the lines of earlier tit-for-tat ideas

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It might be worth replacing the space-saver traffic cone with another one that contains an embedded speaker and a recorded message that periodically drones something like
"This traffic cone and the parking space it occupies are proudly owned and operated by Mr. such and such. Any attempt to violate the property owner's rights will result in repercussions leading to malicious damage to you and your motor vehicle. Contact Ph.No xxx for attractive leasing options.".
For added gravitas the accent could mimic the one that the T uses for public service announcements.
A system like this can probably be hacked together quite cheaply as they are often found in birthday cards, and such.

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A neighborhood picnic with baseball bats?

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The person repeatedly violates the law by replacing the cones. Removing the cones does not good. But they are not cited for any violation of law. That they slashed tires can not be proved without a witness. Even if a criminal charge was proven that might result in eventual retaliation against anyone who testified against them. Slashing tires is a violent act. So what else might they do?

So given the limitations, both legal and in terms of not suffering retaliation, what are reasonable, legitimate and moral responses?

Slashing their tires? That would be illegal. Pouring paint on their vehicle in the middle of the night? Again illegal.

How many neighbors, perhaps friends or family who are not neighbors, would be willing to occupy the space one day, sitting with baseball bats, but enjoying each other's company in conversation, drinking tea and soda, or even having a picnic? When the culprit attempts to park at the spot and sees folks with baseball bats they might start to think that perhaps the tide has shifted against them. The picnickers could invite the neighbor to join in on the picnic as well. Could make for an interesting conversation.

It's amazing when people who slash tires in the middle of the night are faced with lots of smiling faces in the brightness of day.

Even the police complained about a picnic in the street a picnic could still be held - while a friend's or relative's car is parked in the spot. Someone the person doesn't know.

The culprit arrives to park. Sees the spot taken. Also sees neighbors and other folks enjoying a front yard picnic, and, as a group, smiling at the culprit - while holding bats. Clear, unspoken friendly messaging to the jerk that for every action there is a reaction.

No overt threats. Just simply messaging that they are not the only badasses in the world.

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I don't have any answers for how to deal

with the kind of people who feel feel entitled to own a public parking space and are willing to commit vandalism to enforce it. I'm also not sure I see the point in making the tacit threat of violence implicit in sitting around with a baseball bat if you are not willing to follow through with using it, an act which I also do not condone.

I never figured out a civilized response to the kind of people that can't recognize the inherent incivility of setting out space savers, but I'm pretty sure that a response in kind undercuts the argument that not saving spaces is about civility.

The way I dealt with it was moving back to a place where I had more civil neighbors. Much as I believe in my heart that these assholes deserve a crack on the head with a baseball bat, I'm not willing to risk the consequences of attempting to wreak vigilante justice myself. I have a decent short swing, but I believe in the rule of law enough not to anoint myself the parking space avenger. Win or lose that fight, I still lose. More important, civility loses.

Marty's response, tolerating lawlessness in some neighborhoods as a sop to his old-school base, is repugnant to me, but it is what it is. Show me a candidate who says this kind of behavior shall not pass, and I'll consider voting for them. In the meantime, I'm not going to risk my liberty and/or health in a street confrontation with Neanderthals over equal access to public parking spaces.

Too bad it's a fallen world.

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The medium is the message

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A neighbor had a problem with people engaged in illegal activity visiting his house. Reason is more complicated than can be explained here and more personal than is appropriate to go into herre. Fed up he decided to convey a message.

This is how he communicated his message.

When each of the individuals showed up he was sitting in front of his house with a baseball bat across his lap. He calmly and politely explained that the individual was not welcome on his property and even explained why. The baseball bat was a passive object which added to the force of his explanation.

That is what I suggest here. Using the bats as a passive object supporting the message. What you might have noticed as well is the idea of a group of folks sitting together, including folks from outside the neighborhood, communicating to the hostile neighbors that their actions are not welcome.

If the hostile neighbors don't get the message then a Plan B is required. That does not mean that Plan B means a bat. But with some folks the message of meeting action with a comparable action may be enough. Further by seeing other people who are from outside the neighborhood - but whose having a bat communicates that they are aware of the hostile neighbor's behavior sends a message that the hostile behavior will no longer be passively tolerated.

Bullies are bullies because they don't see that the cost of their action is more than they are willing to pay. When the see that the cost is more than they are willing to pay (and a bat is a symbol suggesting the cost will be higher) than they may stop.

People in JP would ride around on motorcycles with exhaust pipes designed to generate noise pollution. Fortunately the police eventually started enforcing a law banning illegal exhaust pipes. But one cop said to me a few years ago to put a string across the street when one particular motorcyclists would roar up my street at 11:00 PM. I declined. But somehow the message got back to the person that the conduct would no longer be tolerated.

A person does not have to fully follow through on an implied action to get the desired response.

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