Hey, there! Log in / Register
The woman who does her grocery shopping at the Boston Public Market
By adamg on Tue, 04/12/2016 - 7:29am
Karen Cord Taylor tags along with a Beacon Hill resident who now does most of her weekly grocery shopping at the Boston Public Market at Haymarket.
Neighborhoods:
Topics:
Free tagging:
Ad:
Support Universal Hub
Help keep Universal Hub going. If you like what we're up to and want to help out, please consider a (completely non-deductible) contribution.
Comments
This is the most inane
This is the most inane article I've read in a while. Rich Housewife spends a lot of money on fancy groceries: watch her do it. Important news.
Wow, harsh. The point of the
Wow, harsh. The point of the story was that it's possible to buy almost all the food one needs for the week at the Boston Public Market. Is it more expensive than shopping at other places? Yes, I'm sure it is. On the other hand, aren't people always saying we should support our local businesses?
"Leslie admits it is usually
"Leslie admits it is usually more expensive to shop at the Boston Public Market, but she does not want her children eating produce sprayed with who-knows-what."
Such an elitist comment,. Does she know who touched the fruit before she bought it, such as Joe from produce who took a leak and didn't wash/wipe his hands?
I was unaware that dirty
I was unaware that dirty hands cause cancer, but evidently Marvin has proof.
Oh Yeah
Hey, so long as the nice, young, white hipster promised it was only sprayed with purified water and protected from acid rain it must be true, right?
Certifications for produce
They exist, you know! Inspections of farms and paperwork, too.
because there's nothing toxic
because there's nothing toxic on the National List?
Yeah, how dare she want to
Yeah, how dare she want to avoid pesticides and other toxic chemicals that are often used on giant agrifarms. Wouldn't you?
Organic/local doesn't mean avoiding anything
Most often, organic farming uses the same pesticides just differently sourced. On top of that, they often have to use more pesticides because it's less effective than the stuff being used on non-organic farms but they can't live off a reduced yield or produce that people won't find "good" enough to buy.
http://blogs.scientificamerican.com/science-sushi/httpblogsscientificame...
Yes, large corporations have
Yes, large corporations have lobbied to make the "organic" label meaningless.
Which is why it's even more important to get to know the people who grow your food personally.
Nothing to do with "corporations"
And everything to do with the fact that if you want a giant bin of "organic" apples in your grocery store, you're not going to grow them on ma & pa's farm and take whatever nature gives you with feast some years and famine the next.
I'd love to see the total
I like the BPM but the prices of most things are out of this world. I realize the problem isn't that they are too expensive, it's that I am too cheap.
The problem with food prices
The problem with food prices in the US is that many are artificially low (and subject to massive change if just a few things go wrong), and some are artificially high (different sort of "artificially", though). When you outsource and offshore all your food production, you really can't complain about either the price or the quality, can you?
Umm, that last sentence is
Umm, that last sentence is just 100% false.
http://www.ers.usda.gov/data-products/ag-and-food-statistics-charting-th...
Please people, stop using
Please people, stop using offshoring and outsourcing incorrectly. If you can't grasp the meaning of the jargon then maybe just don't use it at all. They are both pretty tattered by now anyway so let's give them adjoining rooms next to "begs the question" in the language retirement home.
I don't like what you're inferring here
I don't like what you're inferring here. Trying to find correct usage on forum postings is literally looking for a needle in a haystack. Irregardless of proper usage, I could care less what you think.
Touche!
n/t
parking subsidies
Don't forget about the massive parking subsidy embedded in those prices (see comment below).
So now that DTX has Roche Bros and Haymarket has BPM
Can we get a bog standard grocery store in the area? Haymarket's great for produce, and Boston Public Market is nice, but it's not everyday shopping. I was so excited about the new Roche Bros. when it opened but it's given up so much floorspace to expensive (and not very good) ready-made food and carries very little in the way of cheap but standard staples--all the staples-type-things are expensive "artisanal" varieties.
What Ever Happened...
To the "normal" type grocery store planned for somewhere between Canal and N. Washington?
Do you really have to ask?
It was priced out. You want cheap groceries, your store has to be located on cheap real estate (and you need cheap oil, and relaxed environmental regulations, and relaxed food-safety regulations, and someone somewhere has to work for poverty wages to grow your food, and...)
No it wasn't. "Normal"
No it wasn't. "Normal" supermarket is still signed off for the new building currently going up in front of the Garden.
way off as usual.
way off as usual.
there is a Star Market under construction on Causeway St.
I can't believe Roche
I can't believe Roche Brothers, the exact same stuff they have at hannafords and stop and shop for sometimes double the price.
So shop at Stop and Shop
So don't shop at Roche Bros and shop at Stop and Shop instead. That's the wonderful thing about a free market economy. Enough people want what each is offering that each can find its niche in the market and thrive.
I'm a Market Basket fan myself, but I also buy fish and meat from Whole Foods.
Amen.
Like most people, I shop in more than one place. Russo's for excellent, very reasonably priced produce , cheese, and treats like pickles and olives. Whole Foods and BPM for meat and other hard to find things. Some Costco trips, some stops at Stop and Shop. I'd rather spend a little extra on meat at BPM twice a week than eat crappier meat every day OR eat out a lot--everyone makes their choices.
Pecans
I was going to bake my co-worker a pecan pie as a going away present, but refused to pay Roche Bros DTX $20/lb for regular pecans.
Karen Tags Along
With man who only buys his underwear at Hermes.
With man who only drives less than a 2 year old Range Rover.
With woman who imports her firewood from the woods around Stowe.
With family who is happy to pay the higher fares now that Island Air is gone and the riffraff find it harder to fly to Nantucket for under $200 round trip.
It is easy to pay BPM prices when you can afford what the subject of this story paid for her condo. Good for them that they can do this, but I don't want to read about it as some beautiful people localvore endeavor. Sometimes the apples at Haymarket are good enough.
I read the piece and said
this is satire...right?
Compare Boston Public Market products and other shops...
What comparable products to those at Boston Public Market are available elsewhere at savings?
Marketbasket
Cooking isn't hard. The produce at places like Marketbasket, SnS, etc is fine if you rinse it first. If you want to save even more money try shopping at ethnic supermarkets. (The few are left.)
For Produce we always go to
For Produce we always go to Russo's. They have a tremendous produce at better prices than SnS.
If you want organic ...
MB has a good selection of certified organic produce, too. They also have a lot of local produce from small farms, in season.
I do find the Dewey farmer's market, Mini Roche, and this new market to be very convenient for those "I need only one thing to make dinner tonight" moments. I don't want to get home and have to go to the grocery store when I can just grab two peppers nearby.
Knife skills. Spices. Pantry.
For many folks knife skills are a challenge as well using spices and maintaining a pantry of spices.
Home ec.
Maybe this is why we need to bring it back. I am not a fancy cook but I'm amazed by how many people are intimidated by basic things like making chicken stock or roasting vegetables. Basic cooking skills can save you huge amounts of money as well as keeping you healthy.
Yum
I have to say, I sure would like to eat over at Leslie's house -sounds like they have some fantastic meals! Her kids are lucky. It would have been nice to know how much she spent. I'm glad she is supporting the locals.
Always Closed
I am often downtown on the wrong days. Seems Boston Public Market is closed Mon and Tues, so I've yet to even get inside.
Marketbasket still has the better series of choices and prices, but there are none anywhere in Boston or close by.
Well... there is one in Somerville that's pretty small, and one in Chelsea that is a bit of a drive away from most of Boston to make it worthwhile. But the suburban ones are pretty decent.
Yet to try Wegmans, but I hear their prices are not competitive.
Getting that
RichRoche Bros at DTX was a coup for sure.Yes, it is closed Mon. and Tues.
And open the other five days if the week. And now you know.
Sundays
The one time I visited was on a Sunday, early afternoon, and quite a few of the food/produce stalls were closed. So maybe weekdays/Saturdays are better if you want the full experience.
Joke?
Is this piece a joke a la the recent Globe "front page"?
Rich People Spend More Money on Things
Film at 11.
Drives?
She lives on Beacon Hill yet she drives to the BPM. What is it, all of three blocks?
comment
Let's see if this comment gets approved.
Groceries for four people for one week
I take it that you are completely unfamiliar with how much food that is.
Hint: it is a LOT more than you can carry - particularly if there are teenagers involved. Think "full grocery cart".
The article mentions she
The article mentions she bikes there in the summer (which is cool) - but that makes it hard for me to imagine she gets a full carload of stuff.
She likes her money "going
She likes her money "going into the local economy" but is happy to give it to Exxon Mobil when she is too lazy to walk...
You have no idea
Honey, even I drive to the grocery store. It is one of the few reasons that I even own a car in the first place. I have a similar family to this shopper, so I know damn well that it is a lot more than will even fit into a goddamn bob trailer.
I'm with Kinopio on this
But since we are opposites, I take a different approach.
The in town grocery options are not meant for your (and my) suburban style of shopping. If she got in her car to get to the store, she could have just as easily either driven over the Tobin to the Chelsea Market Basket and gotten decent food at half the price or driven further out to actual farm stands to get the food even closer to the source.
There's no way to cut it- driving from Beacon Hill to Haymarket is pretty boneheaded. Mothers shopped for families bigger than yours back before automobiles were the in thing. People in Manhattan somehow have been buying food for their families since the seventeenth century without motor vehicles. Sorry, but the car hater is right this time.
Karon Cord Taylor tags along with "___________"
This could be a start of a captivating local reality show!
(Alternatively, who is Leslie Adam and why should anyone care where she shops?)
Karen Cord-Taylor tags along
Karen Cord-Taylor tags along with Emily Roomey to ride the T.
It's gotta be hard writing a column
I can't imagine how challenging it is to produce a weekly column. I imagine sometimes you just come up dry, and need to fill those column inches somehow. Even if it's an account of your neighbor's trip to the grocery store.
Ok. I'll buy.
And I get the challenge. However, whether Ms. Adams purchases organic sprayed from heaven produce versus the stuff laced with poisons that the majority of us schmoes have to suffer with, is really in the 'who the heck cares" category. On the other hand, this might be considered "news you can use" by the Hill's denizens.
Speaking as one....
Speaking as one of said denizens, none of the other of said denizens whom I happen to know, would consider this "news we can use."
I volunteer at a food pantry
I volunteer at a food pantry once a month and reading this article infuriates me. A lot of these farmer's markets take SNAP benefits but it is not enough for low income or homeless families trying to survive. What's even worse, middle class who work their ass off but don't quite fall below the qualifying income tier for SNAP benefits can't even think about going to these places all the time like Leslie. Therefore, we see people who don't have the luxury of eating Leslie's food choices crowding the parking lots at Save-a-Lot, Price Rite, Dollar Tree, etc. because they get more meat and produce to feed their family. I don't qualify for food assistance but my employment paycheck is enough to pay my rent and basis bills. I shop where the sales are because that's all I can afford. Have you read the ingredients on food pantry labels? That's why the upper class are beautiful and healthy and the lower class are not. Call it Food Justice.
I hear you but...
Honestly--what's the solution? Food justice, as you call it, is a complicated issue. Are wealthier folk supposed to limit themselves to buying only what low-income people can afford? Compared with buying a Mercedes or a Tiffany bangle, spending money on healthy food seems reasonable to me, especially since it's going straight to a local farm economy. Aside from taking EBT, what would you suggest to make good fresh local food more available?
My suggestion is to have more
My suggestion is to have more fresh produce and protein stocked by local food pantries as opposed to the current highly processed nonnutritional versions. More land available for nonprofits who want to grow their own food in their own community. This is a wise practice of prevention since our pockets are paying for all the health problems of the poor.
Agreed
These aren't opposing missions--you know that the Trustees now run all of the community gardens in Boston so part of their mission is indeed ensuring access to places to grow food?
Providing fresh food to low-income people is a very worthy cause but again--it's complicated. I can say from experience as well as from what I've read and learned--when you are on a limited income and you're working long hours, it can be hard to go home at night and be faced with a raw chicken, some brown rice and a bunch of kale. You want something easier, faster, not something that takes an hour plus to get ready. It's definitely an element of why it's harder to get poor people to eat healthier rather than going for the frozen dinner or fast food--they're tired and pressed for time.
Local Farm Economy
is good for the local farmers but who else? The folks who have means to buy foodstuffs from the Boston Public Market (which is funny since the majority of the "public" really can't afford to purchase much there). It makes some of us feel good (meaning virtuous - i.e. I am supporting the local farmer) to shop at these places (as well as local farmer's markets) but in getting the most bang for your buck it stops sort since the need for healthy food for the masses will not be fed by the local farmer. The need is too big, too great and most of these farms are smaller scale establishments catering to those who can afford $10 a pound for grass fed beef (by way of example).
You are correct that food justice is a complicated issue. I give you that in spades.
From what I've heard
The best spot for a farmer's market, financially, is one where they have a balance of locals, tourists, and commuters. That's why Copley is the most popular market and I'm guessing subsidizes the smaller local markets. And those elements could all work for BPM. Aside from the food-virtue aspect, it also does a lot to employ locals and to showcase local products. Does it serve everyone? Probably not. But does that make it bad or useless? No.
Discount Food
While waiting for the 93 bus to take me to the Charlestown Housing project, I popped into BPM and treated myself to a lite lunch with a big price tag. Ouch. The place was not bustling. I am glad though the BPM has regular shoppers like Leslie. Hope it continues to attract other shoppers. If BPM is out of your price range, try a favorite place of mine, the Daily Table in Codman Square. It is a nonprofit grocery store. The savings there for FRESH food is amazing. Let's face it, places such as the Daily Table need the Leslies and the like, as they spawn places such as the Daily Table. Otherwise, we are stuck with the sodium rich food pantry and big box store choices. So, Maria C., pack away your envy as it only stifles your creativity and generosity. More of these latter characteristics lead to positive social change and excessive envy just ups your blood pressure.
Sorry folks, I tried.
Sorry folks, I tried.
parking
https://bostonpublicmarket.org/about
Of course, since the market validates parking at the garage above — the usual rate is $10 for an hour and $25 for three — you could argue that she may as well drive, since the prices charged at the market stalls represent a massive subsidy to drivers.
Kind of outrageous, no, that a market at an eminently transit-accessible location is giving drivers a $22 subsidy — more than the cost of a 7-day Charlie pass under the upcoming fare hike — to park for three hours, and that shoppers who arrive by foot and the T are massively subsidizing those who drive? Think about that the next time you complain about the market's high prices.
(The nearby Whole Foods will fully pay for an hour's worth of parking — normally $12 at the lot — with a $5 purchase, again a massive subsidy from pedestrians and T riders to drivers.)
It's a steal
Parking is a commodity, you only pay what the lot operator thinks they can get. Same spaces change depending on time of day, day of week, & special events. Use the system for your benfit.
The bars around there will do the same validation. It's not a subsidy, it's a winning hand at the game. And you've been loosing too long.
The market doesn't pay the
The market doesn't pay the garage $22 for each validation. The Parcel 7 Garage is owned by MassDOT, and was intended to be mitigation for businesses affected by the Big Dig. That's why so many local businesses have this $3 validated parking deal.
So depending how you look at it, either MassDOT or the people paying full price at the garage are subsidizing customers of all these businesses.
Get a grip
That garage (state owned) has been there for at least a decade and local businesses have always validated parking. Now we are back to supporting area businesses again. This helps the vendors by attracting customers to it's stalls, it is not a burden on them. It's hilarious that someone would stumble by and think that the farmers/vendors somehow have to pick up some tab for parking. (Oh those darn motorists again!)
parking
These are the market rates for parking on a weekday in this area.
The garage owners wouldn't be charging these rates if the market didn't support them.
Any business that validates parking is paying the garage owner part of the difference between the public rate and the validated rate. And the business recoups those costs by building in those costs to its pricing structure, whether it be a restaurant menu or the rent charged to market vendors. And the market vendors recoup their rent by what they charge their customers.
If I walk in and show my commuter rail ticket, will I get a voucher I can hand to the MBTA?
Then why should motorists be treated any differently?
Unless you're telling me that all these business would shrivel up and go out of business if they didn't validate parking.
When businesses validate parking, every patron of that business is paying a part of that parking, whether they drive or not.
Sure sounds like a subsidy to me: pedestrians and transit users subsidizing drivers.
http://www.nytimes.com/2010/08/15/business/economy...
You have no idea what you are
You have no idea what you are babbling about. The garage (DOT) owns the building, the Market is a tenant. As cited above the cut rate is MITIGATION for the businesses in the area which were affected by the Big Dig disruptions and lack of on-street parking. The Market and it's customers do NOT pay to subsidize parking and it doesn't matter what the rate for parking is down the street. You seem to have a lot of crossed wires connected to a gimme complex.
"Any business that validates
"Any business that validates parking is paying the garage owner part of the difference between the public rate and the validated rate."
Except if some other arrangement with the garage is in place, like it is here.
All kinds of businesses are included in the deal, from fancy restaurants to cheap pizza places to the Haymarket produce vendors.
If this garage is so grossly underpriced, why isn't it always full?
I also suspect that most customers of the other garages in your map aren't paying those prices. Either someone else is paying (like an employer), or they have a monthly deal, or there's validation or some other discount going on. So those prices are higher than the average market rate. It's price discrimination against people who show up once without any advance planning.
If I buy special $50 single
If I buy special $50 single-use walking pants for my walk to the Public Market, can I get reimbursed for them as well?
This is sad
I actually happen to know Leslie Adam. Not well, but she lives nearby.
Yes, she has the good fortune to be wealthy enough to buy her groceries at Boston Public Market.
But did you see anything in the article that suggests an attitude of entitlement? Of looking down on others less fortunate? Is there any reason to believe she is blithely unaware of her own privilege?
In a world that has all too many self-entitled jerks she's a decent, unpretentious person and a solid, friendly neighbor.
Yes, it's a stupid, silly article, but Leslie is not a stupid, silly person. The hatred directed at her on here really makes me sad.
reporter
Then direct your anger at the reporter Karen Taylor.
That sure smacks of elitism, given the questionable evidence of whether non-organically-grown produce is more dangerous for you than organic.
That's were it is
And that's squarely where it resides.
The market is not about organic, it's about local. Her willingness to spend a premium to buy there is creating local jobs. We should be thanking her rather than trotting out the tired "elitist" canard.
Anger
Why does anger have to be directed anywhere? I am seriously not seeing what either of these women have done wrong. I realize that many regular UHub posters feel strongly entitled to the claim of moral superiority that comes with shopping at Market Basket, et. al, but has that entitlement really been seriously threatened because one woman (whose target audience would seem to be residents of Beacon Hill, and possibly Back Bay) profiled the shopping habits of one of her neighbors?
I'm sure you're not surprised
I agree with you, Bob. I think you've been here long enough to know that people jump at the chance to chastise someone because of the simple fact that the someone may have more money than them.
Yeah, but when it's someone you know....
Yeah, but when it's someone you know personally, someone who in no way deserves this crap, it kind of brings the point home.
"she's a decent,
"she's a decent, unpretentious person"....buys salad greens from Corner Stalk Farm in East Boston and loaves of bread from Mamadou’s Artisan Bakery.. I suppose the iceberg lettuce and loaf of white at Shaw's is for the proletariat. This lady didn't need to publicize that she is rich.
I wonder if she's ever set foot in the real East Boston itself
".buys salad greens from Corner Stalk Farm in East Boston "
I wonder if she's ever set foot in the real East Boston itself, one Blue Line stop away from the Boston Public Market? Might be too much of a venture into the real world when she can get it at the upscale BPM.
Who the f cares?
Have you been to Mattapan recently? South Boston? East Cambridge? Most people don't field trip to residential neighborhoods unless they have a reason to go there. This is just silly.
I bet she's been to East Boston
Just about everybody in the metropolitan area, along with millions of visitors from all over world, visit East Boston at one time or another.
Indeed....
Many world visitors only visit East Boston, and don't experience the rest of the city at all.
Seriously?
Did the article say anything about iceberg lettuce, white bread, and Shaw's? Is there even a shred of evidence that this person looks down on people who buy those things there?
I guess folks commenting don
I guess folks commenting don't shop at farmer's markets...The prices at BPM for comparable produce are not that different from the farmers market on many things. There are only a few things that I have noticed tend to run a bit higher, some of the dried beans I can get cheaper directly from the farmer for example, but the price is higher since there are employees to pay to staff it 5 days a week vs only the farmer coming out to the market themselves.
My wife and I love being able to shop local during the week and not just rely on the Cambridge Winter Market on Saturday (we dont use a car so the big stuff is done by me on bike, otherwise we carry in bags from the winter market enough for ~4 days). The BPM has been great for us and we have just switched our spending a bit from WF (milk and last minute items only since it is next to our house) or the COOP in Cambridge but the monthly budgeting has not changed. I don't buy all the food for my wife and I but I buy most of it (and track it) in the months/year before the BPM opened we spent ~$632/month, this included farmers market, COOP, WF etc. In the months since it opened last August we spent ~$595/month, same places as before but now including the BPM. Total we spend ~9% of our yearly income on groceries (it might be closer to 10% including what my wife spends). USDA averages 550/month for food, we are certainly in the higher spending bracket, but most of what we buy supports NE farmers and the state's economy directly, and that is important to us. Each person has reasons for why they shop places, maybe the story was a bit silly and I doubt they would do a story about Joe shopping at the local market basket every week, but either way there are a whole lot of folks that do shop there and its a new and different model than we have seen before in MA
If you do most of your shopping at Market Basket or equivalent, this is not the place for you, and that is ok.
I'd like some of you to stop and think.
There's a woman whom you've never met, whom you now hate solely because some columnist mentioned where she shops for some of her groceries.
Take a look in the mirror and think about your values, your principles, and your priorities, and ask yourself if that is really the kind of person you want to be.
1%er
" In the summer, she often bikes over."
Does she bike to the Shaw's at Prudential too? Or to someone with a 5k sq foot Beacon Hill home with $46k annual taxes, maybe it's beneath her to go to a store that common folk shop at.
Like I said...
Take a look in the mirror and think about your values, your principles, and your priorities, and ask yourself if that is really the kind of person you want to be.
Hate?
Pull your undies out of your ass, man. In five days, they could pass her on the street coming back from the BPM loaded with groceries and not even notice she exists.
They don't hate her. They are raging online. It's largely aimed at a caricature of a Beacon Hill Brahmin paying $500 for a carrot for her pet Hulstlander rabbit, Goldie. In a few days they'll rage at something else they read online. Life goes on.
Speaking of rabbits, I got two 3-lb rabbits from one of the meat stands in the BPM for about $60 one day. They were farm-raised in VT and worth every penny. First time I butchered a rabbit and the fricassee was so tasty. It fed 6 adults.
I don't see rabbit at WF or Wegmans or Stop and Shop or Star. I'm glad the BPM is there.
I used to love rabbit
I used to love rabbit. It's also a pretty sustainable, ecologically sound way to raise meat But one day, the connection between the rabbit on my plate and the rabbits I kept as pets as a kid became too strong, and I don't eat it any more. That's a slippery slope that I fear is going to lead me straight to a vegetarian diet, which would be OK, except for the fact that I enjoy eating meat...
Says the man...
...who got his panties in a bunch over someone getting flocked (which really surprised me, I thought you were joking).
Yes, maybe "hate" was a strong word, but the mockery of the woman is way over the line. Keep in mind, all these comments are based on her food choices, and from people who cherish high-end coffee (Dunks? Never) and $10+ craft beer. Hypocrisy is alive and well.
Thank you Bob. I agree.
Thank you Bob. I agree. Apparently tearing people down for their food shopping choices makes these people feel better about themselves. It's pretty sad, isn't it?
Globe article today on BPM
"Some vendors say the Boston market has come to depend too heavily on a lunch crowd that’s not interested in the venue’s community aspect and doesn’t have time to stop and smell the fresh cut flowers — much less peruse vegetables from local farmers."
Obviously these vendors aim to only serve the elite like Ms. Adam, and not actual working people.
Omf'ingG
What are you not getting here? It costs money to grow stuff, especially in Massachusetts with high land costs. It costs more money to raise an animal, slaughter it, package and sell it. If you want to buy meat from China then no doubt you'll get a better bargain. But these vendors ARE working people--they probably work harder than either you or I do. You think they're getting rich on this? Again--it's a free world. You want to buy cheap foreign produce? Go for it. But don't whine about the fact that MA farmers aren't serving "working people." Maybe skip the watery bucket of DD's coffee and the stale doughnut and the daily lottery ticket and you'll have more money for better groceries.
Story
The farmers don't want us commoners invading their space because we don't have 90 minutes to peruse local vegetables, there's only time to eat and go. They prefer people who buy four $5 tomatoes for Muffy & Biff's salad greens (that's lettuce to the common folk) at dinner.
"If you want to buy meat from
"If you want to buy meat from China then no doubt you'll get a better bargain."
Why is China in this? We're talking about Boston. Or did you really just want to enforce a stereotype?