State rep says it's time to rename the General Hooker Entrance at the State House

Hooker

Earlier today, state Rep. Michelle DuBuois (D-10th Plymouth - Brockton, West Bridgewater and East Bridgewater), tweeted a photo of high-school students protesting guns outside the State House's General Hooker Entrance and asked:

R U a “General Hooker”? Of course not! Yet the main entrance of the Mass State House says otherwise.

#Metoo it’s not all about rape & harassment but also women’s dignity A “funny” double entendre misrepresented as respect for a long dead general?
1 Keep statue
2 Take sign down

In response to a tweet from somebody who suggested she either delete the comment or resign, DuBois elaborated:

No way. I've seen teenboys tease teengirls about being “general hookers” waiting in line at the entrance. Sign is out of context & either Gen’s his first name should be added or change the entrance name. This change is not a priority for me but I do think it should and will happen

The entrance and statue are meant to honor Joseph Hooker, a Hadley native who rose to major general before losing a key battle against Lee that let Lee continue onto Gettysburg.

Earlier:
When Governor Dummer Academy's name was changed.

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Comments

Hehe

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Michelle Do boys. Change your name!

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Voting is closed. 39

The real problem with Hooker?

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Wasn't his surname. It was his performance. He was a lousy general when it mattered most--June 1863.

But you've got to admit that this is the logical conclusion to the PC Monument Removal nonsense that we've been subjected to for the last eighteen months. Difference being that this triggered snowflake is more concerned about his name than his role in US history.

"My feelings are hurt, so everyone must suffer the consequences!"

Bet she can't tell you what state Hooker was from, and which side that state fought for from 1861-1865. But damned if she doesn't know what plays with her equally ignorant base.

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Well...

...I see the insult comics are awake...

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You're right about the lack of knowledge here.

Westie, I do think you (and perhaps others here) are being a bit harsh on the general. His career, while controversial, was actually quite good.

https://www.thoughtco.com/major-general-joseph-hooker-2360584

His performance at Yorktown in 1862:

"Hooker's division took part in the Siege of Yorktown in April and May. During the siege, he earned a reputation for looking after his men and seeing to their welfare. Performing well at the Battle of Williamsburg on May 5, Hooker was promoted to major general effective that date though he felt slighted by his superior's after action report."

Antietam, etc:

"On September 6, he was given command of III Corps, which was redesignated I Corps six days later. As General Robert E. Lee's Army of Northern Virginia moved north into Maryland, it was pursued by Union troops under McClellan. Hooker first led his corps in battle on September 14 when it fought well at South Mountain. Three days later, his men opened the fighting at the Battle of Antietam and engaged Confederate troops under Major General Thomas "Stonewall" Jackson. In the course of the fighting, Hooker was wounded in the foot and had to be taken from the field.

Fredericksburg:

"Recovering from his wound, he returned to the army to find that Major General Ambrose Burnside had replaced McClellan. Given command of a "Grand Division" consisting of III and V Corps, his men took heavy losses that December at the Battle of Fredericksburg. Long a vocal critic of his superiors, Hooker relentlessly attacked Burnside in the press and in the wake of the latter's failed Mud March in January 1863 these intensified. Though Burnside intended to remove his adversary, he was prevented from doing so when he himself was relieved by Lincoln on January 26."

Oh, of course, the battle of Chancellosrville, which opened Lee's route to Gettysburg:

"While the cavalry raid was largely a failure, Hooker succeeded in surprising Lee and gained an early advantage in the Battle of Chancellorsville. Though successful, Hooker began to lose his nerve as the battle continued and assumed an increasingly defensive posture. Taken in the flank by an audacious attack by Jackson on May 2, Hooker was forced back. The next day, at the height of the fighting, he was injured when the pillar he was leaning against was struck by a cannonball. Initially knocked unconscious, he was incapacitated most of the day but refused to cede command."

https://www.history.com/topics/american-civil-war/joseph-hooker

The history channel's topic does not mention any injuries suffered by Hooker at the battle of Chancellosrville.

"Despite having a significant numerical advantage, Hooker was hesitant to engage and ordered his men to fall back during the battle’s early stages. Lee seized on this opportunity by dividing his army in half and flanking the right side of Hooker’s forces in a daring surprise attack. Under heavy pressure, Hooker elected not to counterattack and instead ordered a retreat back across the Rappahannock River in order to shield Washington, D.C., and Baltimore."

http://civilwarhome.com/hookbio.htm

This site has a slightly different take on the battle, mentioning the injury sustained by the cannonball strike near him, unlike the History Channel.

"Once in charge, Hooker's headquarters were roundly criticized by many as a combination of bar and brothel. When he launched his campaign against Lee, Hooker swore off liquor. This may have hurt more than it helped. After a brilliantly executed maneuver around Lee's flank and the crossing of two rivers, Hooker lost his nerve and withdrew his forces back into the Wilderness to await reinforcements from John Sedgewick's command coming from Fredericksburg. Here he felt convinced that Lee was in retreat but was surprised by Jackson's flank attack, which routed Oliver 0. Howard's 11th Corps. To make matters worse Hooker was dazed by the effects of a shell striking a pillar on the porch of his headquarters. He lost control of the army and ordered a withdrawal.
Kept in command, he led the army northward in the early part of the Gettysburg Campaign until he resigned on June 28, 1863, over control of the garrison at Harpers Ferry."

So...the arrival of Stuart's cavalry gave Lee the opening he needed. Stuart told of Hooker's unprotected flank so Lee ordered Jackson to attack.

A book I recommend, is "A Short History of the Civil War" by Fletcher Pratt.

When General Grant's reputation for alcohol was mentioned to Lincoln, supposedly he said something like, "Find out what he drinks and send him a case of it."

If you want some insight into the random ways battles can be won or lost, search for the battle of the North Anna. Basically, Lee had a chance to cut the Union army in half but was too sick to give the order. If he had, it is quite possible that the South could have drawn the war to a stalemate.
It is well documented in the book "Bloody Roads South" by Noah Andre Trudeau.

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Voting is closed. 45

Rename it

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Rename it the "General Lee Entrance", weld the doors shut, and tell everyone to climb in through the windows.

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Maybe get William Shatner to

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Maybe get William Shatner to pose for a statue and make it the T.J. Hooker entrance.

But seriously, this state rep needs to grow up.

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Voting is closed. 106

Better yet

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Find something even sillier, even more juvenile, even more immaterial, and make a fuss out of that.

There's so much to choose from:
Breast cancer research, cuz...ya know...b00bz! hehe
Various animals, like the titmouse, the blue-footed booby, cuz...more b00bz!

People named Richard who go by 'Dick'

The German town of Fucking
All the place names around here and elsewhere with 'squaw' in them
All the place names with 'black' 'brown' or 'yellow' in them...because Racism!

The Charles River could stand to be renamed too...British Monarchy pre Meghan Markle, you see. Can't have that dear boy.

Gund is a maker of cute and fluffy stuffed animals that have brought joy to children for many decades. They clearly need to be boycotted until they change their name.

There's all those global-warming-caused fluffy white clouds that look like politically-incorrect things. So that's more reason to get mad. Also clouds are white, therefor white privilege.

The constellations in the night sky have Western names in the English language. So we could come up with new decolonized constellations and teach those in 3rd grade science class. Ditto for the names of planets and most of the earlier-discovered asteroids. Before the IAU got woke and started naming them after Hawaiian deities, that is. Gotta make them rename all the other ones too. Make up polynesian gods if you have to.

Arithmetic. That's kind of racist. We could decolonize arithmetic. 1 + 1 could equal 2 for white people and 2 + epsilon for people of color depending on how much oppression that particular color is mapped to.

There. That ought to lead to a productive discussion.

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Better yet

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Punish the harassment.

Oh, but that would mean holding males accountable for their behavior. We need to change the sign because we all know that males can't help themselves, right?

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Voting is closed. 35

With apologies to Eric Blair...

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Take away the gun, and instantly change the murder into a cuddly teddybear of a man.

And for the low, low price of rewriting the Bill of Rights, we can cure suicidal depression too. Can't shoot yourself if there ain't no guns, therefore you can't kill yourself if there ain't no guns. Easy as pie!

In fact, why stop there? If you erase the 2nd Amendment, go whole horse and erase the first! Why not expunge the word 'suicide' from the English language? If you purge the language of words for bad things, under penalty of vague and unnameable punishment, the bad things will disappear!

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Yo Roman

I think you posted this in the wrong place.

The "omg they want to take my guns away" thread is down below this one.

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First of all, your keyboard skills could use some work

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The preferred spelling is "zOMG"

Second of all, I put it just where I intended: in the "let's ban things and words that make us feel bad feelings and that'll make it all better (glittery pony emoji)" thread.

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May you reap what you sow

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Snowflake who has never been targeted with these 'things and words', I hope you end up on the receiving end of a jumbo lot of the shit that you laugh at when it rains down on others. It MIGHT teach you compassion. I doubt it, but it's really the only hope for you.

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Nice try

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You can't even admit you landed in the wrong thread?

Wow. That really speaks to character.

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A masterpiece

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Oh, wait, another master bait from Mr. Romaine.

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And then there is

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Becker College which rhymes way to close to a part of the male anatomy.

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My Auntie is offended

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She is part of a group of knitting enthusiasts know as the Happy Hookers, and she sees no problem with the name.

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She should.

"Hookers" would be crocheters because they use crochet hooks. Knitters use needles.

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They don't get paid by the task

And she's a Democrat and won't ever lose election. So why try to do actual work?

This community isn't inhabited by idiots, it's inhabited by the complacent, and it has the government it deserves.

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She's not asking to erase the history

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Calling it the Gen. Joseph Hooker entrance would stop the girls getting harassed at that entrance and wouldn't do anything to erase the memory of the (screw-up) general.

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Wow

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Wasn't sure if anyone was as dumb as Michelle, but congrats.

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You know what stops harassment?

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Holding boys and men accountable for their behavior.

This "name change" bullshit is more of the same "don't tempt boys" bullshit. Sorry. Not buying it. Temptation isn't the issue - allowing and excusing the harassment are.

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Atrocious communication skills

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"RU", "teenboys", "teengirls", and the kicker "sign is out of context & either Gen's his first name should be added or change the entrance name" (WHAT??). Who wrote this, Miley Cyrus? Doesn't sound like someone I would want representing me.

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Voting is closed. 47

It's Twitter

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When in Rome, do as the Romans do. When on Twitter, you, uh... tweet.

(And personally I think it's atrocious that government officials feel pressured to use the birdsite, but that's the reality right now.)

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The real question...

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Did she shoot that photo with a Motorola flip phone circa 1998?

My 2004 inkjet has better resolution printing in the rain.

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Michelle my belle

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Michelle hasn't caused this much controversy since she issued an edict on facebook to Brockton residents to not "Open the doors" because ICE was conducting raids all over the city. It wasn't true of course but she did get some good publicity. Wasn't she supposed to report the sexual harassment she claims to have witnessed by young men taunting young teenage girls at the State House?

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And the Globe never released

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And the Globe never released any names of the legislators from their expose.

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Naw

Unname all the things. All are anon!

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Oh, Ms. "I've always relied on the kindess of strangers" DuBois

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lighten up. It is the General's name. And, actually, although the word "hooker" is best known to be associated with prostitution, "hooker" has other meanings as well, "a one-masted sailboat used in Ireland for fishing" and/or "a glass or drink of undiluted brandy, whiskey, or other liquor."*

And how is adding the general's first name going to stop teen boys from teasing teen girls about the said offense (which has probably happened from time immemorial when teen boys noticed teen girls)?

I'm glad it is not a priority for her since it is not a priority for most.

*Professor Wiki

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You spelled it wrong

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That's Dick Hertz from Holden - and that is a real person living in Holden, actually.

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Quick poll!

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How many of those expressing their rage and contempt for Rep DuBois' proposal are male, and how many are female?

(because I'm wondering why you have no problem with teenaged girls getting harassed but are driven into a spit-spraying rage over the idea of renaming an entrance to the State House)

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Quick answer.

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Female. And I am not "spit-spraying" any rage; just commenting on the silliness of her thinking.

How about the teachers at said event speak to the said male teens about their behavior? Better solution, me thinks. A win win for all.

Your turn: #1 Male or Female? #2 And why do you like using hyperbole to character assassinate those that have a difference of opinion than yourself?

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Male or Femaie?

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Well, I've been a male most of my life. At least I've self-identified as a male.

And my daughter is no longer a teenager, but she most assuredly self-identifies as a female.

Not sure why you're asking but there it is.

Anyways, if my self-identifying female daughter came home to me in her teenage years and said: "Hey, non-binary parental unit. There's an entrance at the Statehouse called Hooker and named after a Civil War General. I feel threatened and triggered by that name Can I get the keys to the safe space?"

That would make me feel like the General Hooker of all parents. Maybe even the Ambrose Burnside of all parents. Of whatever gender.

Got it?

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This is a great idea

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Teenage boys will never make sexual jokes again!

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Instead of renaming the entrance ...

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Why don't we just hold boys and men accountable for their atrocious behavior?

She's simply enabling.

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To stop the harassment...

If there is harassment going on at that entrance, to curtail it, they could change the name of the entrance.

Or, alternatively, the boys could simply stop being assholes.

I think the sign is great. It's a light reminder that once we're gone, even for those few of us who are memorialized with public statues, we're just as likely to be remembered for silly comments about our name as for anything we did or said during our lives.

And it also serves as fodder for jokes that remind us that legislators are for sale.

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Why not both?

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Or, alternatively, the boys could simply stop being assholes.

Why not both?

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Adding "Joseph" sounds good

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"General Joseph Hooker entrance" is a very reasonable suggestion. I don't know why people are so enraged about this.

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Fighting Joe did more for

Fighting Joe did more for this country than she ever will. As somebody who wasn't even born in this state (I got here as fast as I could) I'm dumbfounded that she would take her state's history so lightly, and Civil War history to boot. I guess being wounded while fighting on the side that issued and enforced the Emancipation Proclamation doesn't count for anything these days. He should have made a real contribution to the cause of human dignity and freedom, like launching a social media campaign. Or something.

Whatever Fighting Joe's limitations, he was personally brave and a competent corps commander. He also managed the rare feat of surprising Lee by maneuvering his army deep into Lee's rear (LOL), which looked pretty promising right up until Jackson slammed into him at Chancellorsville. Even after Chancellorsville, he did an excellent job of shadowing Lee's army as it marched north into Maryland and Pennsylvania. Westie: I don't think it's at all accurate or reasonable to call Hooker's performance in June 1863 a failure--the Government at the time certainly didn't think it was since he received the official "Thanks of Congress" for it.

Lastly, and most damningly from a Civil War buff's persepctive, there's a statue of Nathaniel Banks in Waltham. Nathaniel Banks?!? Hooker isn't exactly Murat, but if we're going to take down statues of middling-at-best Union generals, we should be pulling down Banks way before Hooker.

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We need to catch our breath here

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Look, she is being an idiot here, but one of her suggestions, adding the General's first name to the sign, is not a bad idea at all. Of course, that will cost money, which I am sure she will donate personally towards so that no woman in the future will be insulted while waiting to enter the building. And sure, people will still call it the General Hooker Entrance or just the Hooker Entrance, but whatever.

Perhaps they should work on making the old main entrance the main entrance, since it is more impressive, but that's just me talking.

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If your name is Michael ya

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If your name is Michael ya betta change it! MICHAEL MICHAEL MOTORCYCLE!!

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Instead of her drawing more

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Instead of her drawing more attention to the sign and name (maybe creating a short-term spike in the behavior she decries), are there bigger problems she might try to deal with?

Is there still the occasional highly visible gaggle of "ladies of opportunity" gathered outside the Boston Harbor Hotel at Rowes Wharf when visiting NBA teams are in town? ...or is that a "last decade" thing?

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Lunch

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Did they walk to Ding Ho for lunch?
It is a terrific value!

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As if Brocktonians needed

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As if Brocktonians needed another reason to be embarrassed to tell people where they live. Thanks, Rep. DuBois.

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