South Boston roast-beef place dies to make way for more luxury condos

New building at 170 West Broadway in South Boston

Boston Restaurant Talk reports Liberty Bell Roast Beef, 170 W. Broadway, is closing, possibly as soon as tomorrow, as the parcel's owners ready the site for construction of, ta da, 33 condos and a new restaurant space that will probably involve a wood-fired oven and a complete line of artisanal vodka drinks.

The BRA recently approved plans for the eponymous 170 West Broadway. The project goes before the Zoning Board of Appeals for its perusal on Aug. 5.

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Comments

In reality, it's really just

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In reality, it's really just returning the area to its historic and appropriate density. The Liberty Bell (and the stretch to Amrheins) is a prime example of post WWII city suburbanization. Recreating density here is not a bad idea.

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"Recreating density here is

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"Recreating density here is not a bad idea." Really? I think we have gone above and beyond that point in South Boston already. Developers are talking away all 'green' spaces, parks etc. They are putting up gross buildings that do not fit in the neighborhood and building them higher and higher each time and not providing parking. Where do you live and how would you like it if this was happening next door to you?

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what is a fact?

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There were more buildings on that particular block? So what. There are hundreds of new condos where there was grass or single family homes. Enough already. Take you facts and ......,

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Soooo b/c there were more

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Soooo b/c there were more buildings in this particular area it is a win win? Take a drive through Southie sometime soon. There are many buildings where there were none years ago. There are buildings where there was grass, gardens,schools back yards. There are buildings EVERYWHERE! I doubt you would like this going on in your back yard if you are lucky enough to have one.

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indeed

While the food might be good, looking at streetview, it's an awful waste of space.

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waste of space?

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Put some city gardens in there or here's is a good idea how about a parking garage instead of making the problem worse with MORE condo's .

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new condos at liberty bell site

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Yes, there was a lot of space and it should have been used for a park with trees & flowers which is no where to be found in this area. Trees will help with all the extra pollution from all the extra cars & traffic West Broadway has now. The air quality is terrible. Every day I have black soot on my window sill facing West Broadway.

Let's knock down all the old

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Let's knock down all the old triple decker a that provide zero parking for any of the 3 families/roommates that live there.

Wood Should Only Be Used For Toilet Paper

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Ok you might be trolling here, based on some other previous posts from a 'Heather' but...

Tripple deckers are one of the worst kinds of urban blight this city has. I would almost rather live in one of the bomb-shelter style, Bromley-Heath buildings.
I recall one I lived in where if the third floor neighbors were having sex the whole building would literally sway in time, to the point where people on the second floor would get sea sick. Not exaggerating.

In the space occupied by a few three deckers you could build a small, 5 stories or so, building that houses more people, in more solid construction [if built well, with concrete between floors and walls, to deaden sound and improve stability]. And there would still be enough room on the plots for some small amount of parking and a small pool or garden. And the units could be sold, if not in a super central neighborhood, for well less than $200k and still reap the developer tons of money. Such buildings can also be built with ground floor restaurant or retail space to bolster the monetary intake if the street is not a tertiary one.

But there is a danger that any developer one gets is going to cheap out on construction. For example, those new buildings in Allston along Brainerd are just plywood under all the cladding. Also you need to find a developer who is not unusually greedy so that they agree to reasonable pricing of the units. Just because the market says you can charge $200k/1350 per month for a 300 sq foot studio in Allston does not mean you should do that.

Find a developer who is not

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Find a developer who is not unusually greedy??? hahahaha I hope you are joking.

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Three deckers were a way of

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Three deckers were a way of life , a stepping stone to the owner occupied two family. You want more, they won't be owner occupied. Plus, the landlord rules change . Buy a lot yourself , build what you want. But if you want to live in it yourself , be ready for a culture shock. Being a landlord is no bargain.

That makes no sense

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So your argument is that because Southie was once an overcrowded slum its "appropriate" to return it to that state? Who gets to what its correct historical state is? When exactly was Southie's most "historic and appropriate density?" 1790? 1830? 1870? 1910? 1935? 1955? 1975? If we're going to turn Southie into a historical restoration project shouldn't someone besides greedy developers get to chose what the town's best years where? Pre-WW2 Southie wasn't a fun place full of artisanal coffee shops and organic-vegan bakeries. When we return it to your preferred period of historical authenticity can we at least close all the places that sell $8 cupcakes?

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Yeah, let's not add any

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Yeah, let's not add any housing, then housing prices will go down, because economics, right? Is that how it works?

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The problem is this type of

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The problem is this type of building encourages individuals to move to the city rather than families. While families contain siblings and spouses that might share a bedroom (3 or 4 people for a 2 bedroom), individual transplants generally require one bedroom each, increasing the demand for housing and therefore cost.

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Right

Because everyone is moving closer to public transit and jobs because they want to buy a car and drive it everywhere.

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Bottom line is, that more

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Bottom line is, that more condos is more likely to increase the number of cars rather than reduce them. If the streets and parking lots are any indication, yes many people do for whatever reason like to keep a car in Boston.

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The same jerks

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Who oppose 7 day resident parking because there is no place for "their" friends to park. Well you're right they should take their bikes or skateboards.

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SwirlyGrrl I'm guessing your

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SwirlyGrrl I'm guessing your response is sarcastic. It is the assumption that new residents will not have cars that got Southie into this parking problem. How dothey get home to Mommy and Daddy's mansion anyway?

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"Because everyone is moving

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"Because everyone is moving closer to public transit and jobs because they want to buy a car and drive it everywhere."

This sarcastic comment is why the neighborhood has a parking problem. Wake up! People that are moving here have cars! They have every right to own them. However there should be a space for them to park in and that is the problem with all of these new developments. They are underestimating the number of cars the residents own.

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"Right"

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You used that word, it does not mean what you think it does.

Nobody has the "right" to own a car. More than half of Boston does not own a car, and the city is intentionally capping spaces in new developments.

Congestion is a problem because of too many spaces, allowing too many people to drive for transportation.

They are capping spaces yet

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They are capping spaces yet people are still moving here with cars. It isn't working!!!

Show me where the "too many

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Show me where the "too many spaces" are. I would like to park in one of those. Oh wait, they do not exist.

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cars are a luxury in cities

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Cars are a luxury in cities. Boston needs to provide infrastructure upgrades to allow all neighborhoods to make better use of public transport to go along with all these news condos. The developer should pay into an infrastructure fund for each unit built as no one is provisioning for the much needed infrastructure upgrades.

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I could understand your whole

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I could understand your whole cars being a luxury opinion if this were downtown Boston. It is not. It is/Was a family neighborhood and hasn't
experienced these problems until recently.

tax incentives to developers

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I can't speak to the over-development developers in Southie, but in Downtown (see Filene's site) and the former Chinatown (now rebranded as the Thee-ayter district), these multi-national corporations such has Millennium Partners have shaken down the city for "tax-incentives" to build and profit mightily from high rise luxury condos. Where is the money to repair the failing T from these robber barons? The transportation system that many of these wealthy residents want to use.

Cars Are A Luxury

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I would be able to see your point if this was downtown but it is not downtown. It is a neighborhood that didn't have this problem until recent years. It's not like I moved here being aware of this situation and had a choice not to come here. I was here before all of this madness. Why should I suffer? I need my car to go to work to support my family.

Box

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This looks like the condos at 45 L Street, and the ones at L and Second Street, and the one at K & Eighth Street, and the one on D and Second, and the one on L and Emerson Street, and the one on M and Fourth street and ....................

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Better use of the street scape.

West Broadway used to have many more buildings that met the street wall. This is more housing where there was none and knowing the interior of Liberty Bell from a few high school visits, you are replacing a near equal amount of retail square footage in the new building. Win win.

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Win Win?

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Would you be all for this if it was happening in your back yard? Win Win??? Where are all of these people going to park? They do not provide nearly enough spots needed for these new condos. They are knocking down buildings that give the town character and putting up box buildings.

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I too noted the distinctive character of the Liberty Bell

building in my Phoenix review, to wit: "The Liberty Bell looks like the love child of a cinderblock fallout shelter and a down-at-the-heels convenience store. Inside isn't much better: naked laminate tables, institutional-green accents, fluorescent lighting."

(The theme of the review is, "Don't judge a book...", because I really like their food, despite the incredibly homely setting.)

One Of My Faves

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I wrote an op-ed piece concerning it, about a month ago, but both major Boston dailies passed. In hindsight, I can understand their decisions. My love for the place may have come across more like a plug than they would have been comfortable with. Nevertheless, since it won't see the light of day elsewhere, I'll take the liberty (ha!) of posting it here.

************************************

Liberty Bell (521 words)

Change is inevitable. We all grow older, and some of the things we know and love go away. This is particularly true in South Boston these days. New buildings sprout amidst the old as abundantly as dandelions on a spring lawn. Lifelong residents, for whom the old feel of the neighborhood means everything, decry the “yuppies” incursion on their sacred land. Meanwhile, some of the newbies have few kind words for those they describe as “townies”.

Be that as it may, I'm here to mourn the loss of something in Southie which I consider absolutely vital to my happiness – the best roast beef sandwich in Boston.

Liberty Bell has been an institution in South Boston since 1979. The somewhat nondescript restaurant, on West Broadway between B and C, has served up great sandwiches, pizza, seafood platters and fries, for 35 years. It has been THE go-to place for many a softball bum, such as myself, for after-game feeds following a hot night at the M Street ballpark, but now it will be going the way of the dodo.

The reason? Just about all property in Southie is hot property right now and Liberty Bell sits smack in the middle of a fair-sized chunk of prime real estate. Some developers realized this, so they put together plans to erect a five-story condo/apartment building in the spot where I've enjoyed roast beef sandwiches since twenty pounds around my middle ago.

The big picture, for those excluding gluttonous freaks like me who think barbecue sauce stains on a softball uniform are a nice fashion statement, is probably good. Thirty or forty apartments will be filled with happy people. Property values are likely to rise all around once construction is completed. The units are slated to include off-street parking, a good thing when taking into account the abundant parking problems in the neighborhood. The current owners of Liberty Bell will be compensated well (and, who knows, maybe the restaurant will pop up in another incarnation at a later date; it's tough to keep a good roast beef sandwich down.)

(That doesn't sound right, but I'm too broken up about the loss of a favorite gustatory delight to rephrase it. You know what I mean, though, so let it stand.)

Yup, the neighborhood is changing, as all neighborhoods do (for better or for worse.) Liberty Bell is still there, but it probably won't be by this time next year. I suggest you get over to South Boston and fill up. The sandwiches are as stuffed with moo as they've always been and the pizza still comes in huge crispy-crust slices. The prices are reasonable and the service friendly. That's how you last 35 years in the same location and get a faithful clientele (some of whom will write glowingly about you in a big daily newspaper.) But time is running out. Tell 'em Sully sent you. If they still let you in after you've said that, they probably won't charge you extra.

###

Suldog
http://jimsuldog.blogspot.com

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What does the BRA actually do

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What does the BRA actually do besides push through all of these enormous buildings that overcrowd the neighborhood and take away parking spaces?

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You obviously do not live or

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You obviously do not live or have not visited South Boston lately. Developers are building all over the place and not providing sufficient parking for the residents. There are far more cars than spots for people to park in South Boston. This issue has been ignored too long and now it is at a crisis point.

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Huh?

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This response can't be real. It's too blatantly stupid. I hate the developers because the neighborhood is returning to the density that made it a great neighborhood. I prefer the shitty policies of the 1960s and '70s.

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The "density" used to be

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The "density" used to be families who had 1 car for 4 people rather than a bunch of transplants who live in the city for a few years for work and who often bring one car for each person. You have to be ignorant to not see the difference.

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I lived 200 feet from there

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I lived 200 feet from there for many years up until 2005. Without a car. Used the Zipcars that were in Fort Point when I needed to. Walked to the South End if I needed something exotic, like, pancetta, that Stop and Shop didn't carry. If having a car and easy parking access are so vitally important why wouldn't you chose somewhere else to live? I certainly would.

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Why wouldn't I choose to live

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Why wouldn't I choose to live somewhere else? Ummmm maybe because I lived here before all of this started and if I want to have a car I will have one. I should be able to park in my neighborhood that I have lived in for 40 years.

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Well, you can still have your

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Well, you can still have your car you just might need to walk a little further to get to it.

That is the point

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It isn't just a little bit further or I wouldn't care. If you come home after 7pm there are ZERO spots. You are forced to double park and get a ticket. This problem multiplies by 10 in the winter.

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Easier said than done

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walk a little further to get to it??? You obviously have no idea what is going on or how bad the situation is. And don't tell me to get rid of my car. I need it for my job so I can pay to live and work here.

What about the guy that lived

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What about the guy that lived on West whatever number that worked at the S & S warehouse on C street that is now in Freetown , what does he do ? Zip line ? It seems like if you have a job ( and not everybody woks 9 to 5 ) that requires a car , everybody wants you to just disappear.This place was here before most people , and it is changing. But out with the old, in with the new don't cut it . Go down to M street and think about it before you think you can just change what you want when you want.

http://www.vietvet.org/massvets.htm

Really?

Because the Olde Somerville families that lived near an old apartment of mine in the mid-late 1980s had one car per adult - and four adult children still living at home, two parents, and a grandparent - every one had cars. It was the "transplants" who had no more cars than they had off-street parking for.

Ditto where we lived in Arlington - we had one car, the neighbors upstairs had five people in a three bedroom unit, and four cars. They had lived there since the 1950s.

More recently, in Southie, my former research assistant lived in an apartment with his wife and two roommates and none of them had a car (which was one reason they lived in Southie) - while their landlord and landlady, an elderly relative, and their two grown kids each had a car.

Need I say that every single one of these old families were insanely obsessed with "their" parking? Our Arlington landlord finally had to explain to the upstairs tenants that they had only two car parking in their lease and he would evict them if they blocked us out of the driveway one more time (one of the three spaces was ours - they would cram four cars into "their" driveway and we would get ticketed). One of the neighbor lunatics in Somerville tried to house paint a "reserved" spot in front of one of the bays of the garage of the house across the street (this wasn't even public property). The old bat argued with the cop that it was a public street and it was "her" spot!

Sorry, but I ain't buying the "transplant" theory. Based on my experience with how these old families in neighborhoods act and operate, I'm betting most of these excess cars belong to those families that you claim only have one per unit, but really have one per adult.

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I said years ago they had 1

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I said years ago they had 1 car per family. That is not the case now hence the problem. People are moving in 3-6 per apartment/condo and all have cars on top of the cars that are already here. If there are new developments being built there should be garage spots to accommodate them. Don't make this into a blame game for transplants because that is not the case. They should be able to have cars but the BRA and developers need to do their job. People have every right to be crazy about parking. Why should you have to park your car 6 blocks away if you are lucky to find a spot at all?

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Why have a car at all, then?

The problem isn't "new people": the problem is "too many cars".

Would you support a limit of two registrations per legal unit? How about two parking public space permits per unit? How about a coordinated plan for car sharing programs to take up the occasional car use? (Zip Car has a long enough history to know that each car results in 8-12 fewer cars in an area as residents who don't use their car much switch over).

That would be the fair way to portion out the public resource.

Alternately, paint out spaces, limit permits to the number of spaces and put a price on the spaces (and then you can say it is YOUR space and have any interloper towed). The money raised could stay in the neighborhood, even.

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Re:why have a car at all,then?

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What I would support is when there is a new 'luxury" condo being built that they provide ample number of off street parking that they are supposed to provide. I would also support building a garage at various spots in the neighborhood for visitors to park along with angled parking to create more space. This problem is out of control because it has been ignored and Menino kept saying new residents don't drive. Newsflash!!! They do!

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In my 20 years here, and

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In my 20 years here, and having lived in 10 neighborhoods in Boston proper, I have to agree with this.

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I don't think he was blaming

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I don't think he was blaming "transplants", so your anger at "old families" who grew up in Boston may be a bit displaced (and could be just a few examples personal to you). I assume the original comment was directed at the many 20 somethings who move into a 3 bedroom in a triple decker and each have a car, which gets to 9 cars per triple decker.

That's great that your research assistant and his friends had no cars, but plenty of 20 somethings in southie don't live like that. My roommate and I each had a car when we lived there 10 years ago, as did every other occupant of our building, my then girlfriend and her roommates in a separate building and my roommates then girlfriend and her roommates in yet a different building. More relevant to today, my cousins, friends and coworkers who live there currently each have a car, too (as do the families of some of my friends from southie). So these parking concerns are legitimate, IMO.

Also, the comments above were about restoring the "original" density in the neighborhood, which likely means more than your example of 20 years ago. As late as the 70s, plenty of families in Southie had only one car. That's certainly not the case today.

On the plus side, if rents continue to rise to insane levels, no one moving there will be able to afford a car so maybe this issue will resolve itself!

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Yes!

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Nicely put Bob Murphy!

Muricans love cars... duuuh.

It will be great to get past them but it's a bit utopian now.

I'll never own one even when I end up with piles of free money.

I can't stand them and would like few things more than to see the place outgrow them.

Maybe it'll happen by 2035 or something, but I'll be comfortably dead then.

The townie /transplant conflict is probably not useful as an explanation of metal stink pot proliferation.

Neither side enjoys a monopoly on stupid, they just express it in different ways. Each side is in it's own bubble wrap of unexamined assumptions.

Boston may have contained 800k plus people back when we burned a lot more coal than we do now, but how much of that living space has since been chowed by highways and other non residential space clusters?

And does it even make sense to wish for another 200k people when the city is pretty inept at handling the cohort it has?

And there were no burbs back in the 800k days. I watch them build out over my life time.

The sleepy meadows of little hick rail town Reading were wiped out and replaced by suburbia.

For all its faults, many people still prefer it.

You might get an orderly anti sprawl outcome, from an upward build, of shiny happy people pedaling and using zipcars, but you could just as well end up with a bunch of motorists and a parking clusterfuck.

It's a crap shoot.

The anxieties make sense however inconvenient and xenophobic and the real outcome of shoehorning more affluence into the area isn't knowable.

And speculating on whether these imaginary carless affluent sorts are going to fill up all the pipe dream luxury space being prepared for them is comparably dicey.

I agree with you Bob Murphy.

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I agree with you Bob Murphy. There is a 3 decker on my block and there are 15 cars that belong to the residents there. In years past there would be 3 cars there at the most.

@Huh

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You must not live here because these buildings are not making the neighborhood great. If there is a tiny patch of land they build on it. Developers are taking away all of the parks and any type character the neighborhood had and replacing it with generic sky scrapers.

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Name one public park that has

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Name one public park that has had a condo development built on it in Southie. Empty lots zoned for commercial and or residential do not count, so please do not try to claim the industrial wasteland along the east first corridor is park land.

Condo owner in Southie for the past 7 years. My husband and I consolidated down to one car since we only have on garage parking spot. I have never seen a building go up in a public park. Your insisting in several posts in this thread that developers are taking away "All the parks" is ridiculous.

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Are you saying in your time

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Are you saying in your time living in South Boston you have not seen a condos go up where there was once open space or grass? Not true. You and your husband should not have to give up one of your cars. The people who built your unit and the people who approved the amount of spaces for your building should have provided more spots for your cars. Most other people cannot downsize to 1 car so they take street spots and here is where we have the problem.

Had to laugh

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I had to laugh when I saw that "park" reference. I guess to us Southie old timers those empty lots full of weeds were our "parks" on the Lower End!! As a kid I used to spend quality time in some of them catching grasshoppers and checking out the latest blooms on the weeds! Oh, funny.

I just wonder what the cost of the non affordable condos will be here. The ones down a couple of blocks next to the old Mignosa's (Baileys 2) have sold for $999K.

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I did not make the post about

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I did not make the post about the parks but there are an enormous amount of areas especially up the City Point area that were grassy areas that the neighborhood children used to play in. I'm assuming this is what they are referring to and they are correct. They have all been taken over by tacky looking codos.

No Park[ing]

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Have you seen the site in question?
Hardly tiny, nor a park, and definitely no character worth saving here:
http://goo.gl/maps/sHKbx

In fact I am fairly sure one would be hard pressed to locate a newer building that was built in a park there. But if you know of one that has reduced city-owned recreational space, please indicate it.

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I just read the original post

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I just read the original post and I didn't see it written anywhere that the poster hates the developers. I would say there is more anger towards the BRA for not doing what they are supposed to do. It's not nice to call people stupid. Relax. It's only an online article.

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Explain

Why is the BRA supposed to create parking? Forcing people to build and buy parking is a part of the affordability problem.

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"Affordability" not relevant to luxury condos

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By their very definition, luxury condos are not affordable, rent controlled units be damned.

Complaining about forcing people to build and buy parking packaged into their complexes full of million-dollar condos is patently absurd. They can and should be forced to pay the price of that parking regardless of whether the first or second or even third tenants sell their cars and disavow vehicle ownership, because there's no realistic way to guarantee that no tenant in that specific unit will ever own a vehicle, and no way to guarantee that whatever embargo you place or try to place against new properties receiving residential parking privileges will survive three or four or five changes in residents or owners or city administrations.

Instead of hand-wringing over the plight of the poor against the backdrop of disaffected 20-somethings and 30-somethings driving luxury cars and living in luxury housing as Southie turns into Disneyland, let's go ahead and force them to pay for their parking. Let's force the developer to take the hit on spaces it doesn't feel it needs. On the off chance they're actually right, and the off-street spaces sit empty and forlorn, I might shed a single solitary tear over the lost profits of the developer and the extra monthly cost incurred by the residents.

I'm all for the end of parking minimums for developments that meet tough standards for what is affordable to the poor or accessible to renters outside of the high-end of the market; but this property and most of the development that has occurred recently isn't even close to meeting either standard.

Let's have the parking debate in threads where it's actually relevant - like when parking minimums and other regulations make it impossible for developers to move forward on middle range and lower end housing, when a building that could've put hundreds of new units in the $500~$900 range gets stopped by NIMBYs, when developers choose the path of fad housing or building "micro" units unfit for human habitation instead of making good on their responsibility to actually build affordable and somehow even make THOSE units cost-prohibitive for all but the high-end market.

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Uh, no, it's people who

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Uh, no, it's people who convert triple decker a to condos and then require 6 on street parking spots with zero owned parking spots that create the issues.

How many of those people back

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How many of those people back then all had cars? You could say the same thing about a lot of neighborhoods in Boston. There used to be more people back then, but there were more families that might have only had 1 car for four people.

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what year was that? I would

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what year was that? I would guess when each family had 1 car per household. It is common for a triple decker in Southie to have more than 10 cars at one address these days.

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Funny

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All the people here who try to tell people in Southie how to live, how to park etc. don't live in the City never mind South Boston. It's called Uhub not U-Arlington or U- Quincy.

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Boston-bashing is a favorite suburbanite pastime

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Suburbanites love to whine and complain about what city people should do, what they shouldn't do. I hear more bitching and moaning from my suburban relatives in NH about what's wrong with Boston than anyone else! There's nothing to do in the 'burbs, but whine and cry about Boston. Time for certain non-city dwellers to get a new hobby... perhaps visit a museum, read a book, go for a walk, break free from your insular bubbles.

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I pay $20 a day to park in South Boston

When I bring my car in. I don't mind - that is market rate.

But mind you, that is market rate.

Also, when I lived in the city, I either didn't have a car or I bought a car ONLY after I had off street parking for said car.

Anyone who does otherwise should go fish.

But, for the sake of this "outsiders blah blah" nonsense: if you have to know, Boston is not entirely self sufficient. The tax dollars that I pay on money that I earn while spending most of my waking hours in Boston also pay for Boston services - like parking.

Again, I don't entirely mind as my community also benefits, and my office building has water, etc. I do, however, mind that there is a lot of parking abuse in the area by locals - such as an entire street of meters taken up by handicap placard parking in areas where there are no jobs within a couple of blocks? Some are legit, no doubt - but not likely all of them.

I bet you didn't know this, but some of your South Boston neighbors don't just use that sticker to park near their home, either. This becomes apparent when they also overnight space-save places in Fort Point, where they park when they go to work. I'm not joking. The stickers aren't neighborhood specific, and, now that Fort Point is getting housing, these overnight space savers are starting to pitch fits at the people who actually live there.

They get this for the miniscule price of a sticker. And, somehow, that miniscule price seems to make them entitled to not only a space at home but to harass people who take "their" space near work? C'mon! That isn't a "lack of parking" problem, but an unjustified entitlement problem.

That's why I find arguments that any sort of "build more parking" or "make newcomers build parking" to be specious. If you want to manage parking properly, put a price on its head. Just like in the lots in Fort Point - that price is a deterrent to daily driving.

Oh, and you are aware of the parking cap, right?

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A ridiculous response. N

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Someone from Medford complaining about their tax dollars going to support Boston is akin to someone in Mississippi making the same claim about Massachusetts. That's just not how it works.

But keep making these absurd arguments to support your "connection" to Boston. Heh.

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SwirlyGrrl

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By saying go fish are you implying that I sell my car in my neighborhood that I have lived my entire life and had plenty of parking until recent years because of poor planning by the city and developers? The short and long answer to this is NO. It's easier to give your solutions when you are not currently living in the situation day and night 365 days a year. This is not about bashing new comers either. They have just as much right as I do to park their cars in their homes but are not provided the space to do so. Money hungry builders would rather squeeze in another unit rather than provide a realistic number of spots per unit.

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Yes I am aware of the parking

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Yes I am aware of the parking cap. A lot of good that is doing. The cars are still multiplying and because of the parking freeze there is no where to put them. Condo's are being built up and more people are moving here. They have vehicles and don't have place to put them off the street. Either stop building or don't allow new residents to own cars. I don't think you should deny someone the right to own a vehicle so the solution would be to stop building or stop the freeze and add spots.

Explain

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How does this overnight space saving at Fort point work?

Surprisingly So

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I didn't 'discover' the pizza there until very late in the game. One evening, I was very hungry and impatient. As I waited for them to make up my roast beef sandwich plate - fries had to cook - I decided to try a slice. I was very pleasantly surprised. It was huge, had a wonderful crispy crust, and a nicely balanced blend of cheese and sauce. A very good sort of standard New York style slice.

Suldog
http://jimsuldog.blogspot.com

Sucks

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Man this sucks, I love this place.

People in southie cant have

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People in southie cant have it both ways. They claim that leaving trash as space savers is a time honored tradition for decades in southie because of the lack of parking, yet also claim that suddenly things changed in the past few years because people who weren't born there have moved in causing a parking shortage. Sounds like there was always a problem with parking, even for the people whose decedents were placed their by jeebus.

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Both ways?

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The spot savers are put there b/c you worked to shovel the area out. It is especially bad now due to lack of parking and lack of other people shoveling. People think the condo association should take care if it but no one ever does so you want to save your hard work and not give it up to someone too lazy to do the work themselves.

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The space saver wasn't about

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The space saver wasn't about shortage of parking. It was about the time it took to shovel or out in winter only to have some a hole take spot. ..

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There are no reserved seats in a game of musical chairs.

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You realize that one is not shoveling out the spot, one is just shoveling out one's car so they could drive it somewhere. One is not reserving the right to save and use the spot by shoveling, one is reserving the right to use one's car that day.

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Good question!

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somebody in the know, answer please?! I've wondered this every time I've driven by there.

Castle Island

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Pretty soon they will be converting Fort Independence into "luxury" condos!

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$490,000 going rate for a 2

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$490,000 going rate for a 2 bedroom 1 bath in South Boston, you can buy a 6 bedroom 3 bath for same price in East Boston which is more appealing than South Boston !!

Southie

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Southie needs to relax with these luxury condos, they're ruining traditional Boston and plus people can't afford them

Wow! It took you long enough

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Wow! It took you long enough to chime in Adam. Were you on vacation or something? You are usually the 1st to start the Southie bashing.

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Patronize

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The yuppies didn't eat here because they couldn't get arugula or citrus vinaigrette on their sandwiches.

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Neighbors who are complaining about parking are duplicitous

What the neighbors won't tell you is that there will be a 100+ seat restaurant on the first floor-and there is NO off-street parking for any of the diners, which means much, much more congestion as a result of that than of the 33 condo owners upstairs. No one even mentioned it during conversations about the building and no one's complaining now.

So how come you're against the condo owners and not the restaurant?

http://www.bostonmagazine.com/real-estate/blog/2014/07/15/residents-beef...

For the Restaurant?

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Where on this page do you see anyone supporting the restaurant and more cars? It is quite the opposite. The entire building is opposed unless they can provide sufficient parking for all cars residents and or restaurant patrons.

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Wrong my friend

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I am a DIRECT abutter and both NEW and OLD resisdents APPROVED this with no contingency. We had an advisory bored of OLD and NEW residents along with the developer and neighborhood heads from both Saint Vinny's and help from WBNA . We have ben working and meeting for months. So dont say 'we " will stop this as it has already happened and WE are very pleased with it. both OLD AND NEW

Also , if you want to point fingers at developers and yuppies . You should also take a step back and point fingers at your neighbors who have SOLD OUT "your southie" for over 20 years and continue to do so to make the BIG BUCKS and move to the South Shore . And blame yourself too for not buying enough subs at the Bell to keep the owners from cashing in for millions.

Yuppie?

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I didn't see that word in the post. No need to YELL in your comment. Take it down a notch angry new resident.

Take it down a notch

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Ha ! ok . been here 15 years not new and not leaving.

Where in the post was it

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Where in the post was it suggested that you leave? You are making a fight where there isn't one. Relax

Really?

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I think it would be understood that any extra cars are opposed? Just because the restaurant is not specifically mentioned doesn't mean it is supported. What angle are you trying to spin here? Bottom line is we can not support any more cars on the street no matter what they are for. Don't make a fight where there is not one.

JohnAKeith

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Why in the world would you think these neighbors would want a 100 seat restaurant without parking? Have you read the rest of the comments? It is the last thing needed in the area.

Hilarious

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So neighbors are for the 100+ seat restaurant and all of the cars/noise that brings? Get real buddy.

All the Yuppies

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Are going to Über over there.

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Liberty Bell

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had parking. The owners were not gullible thinking their customers were going to walk or bike there for a Big Beef.

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Another day!! Another!!!

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Another day another dollar going in to building a place full of Bro's and Becky's ....and another restaurant to sell there favorite sandwich with sprouts....!!!

Pizza

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Did Stash do wood stove?