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Steve Murphy: How the hell did that woman get all that cyanide out of Northeastern?
By adamg on Tue, 09/14/2010 - 7:32am
The Herald reports that Councilor Murphy, head of the council's public-safety committee, will hold hearings on whether colleges are doing enough to protect the public from deadly chemicals (note to the councilor: cyanide is not a "pathogen"), such as the cyanide an apparently suicidal Northeatern lab tech took home with her to Milford the other day.
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Comments
Fail
The cyanide at issue here is a common chemical salt, probably sodium or potassium cyanide, and it looks pretty much like ordinary table salt.
It is alarmist to claim that someone could kill a whole neighborhood with a small bag of cyanide: it is technically true, but that person would need to go door to door and ask people to eat some cyanide.
There is no reason to test MBTA trains for "traces of cyanide." Cyanide is water soluble: even if a trace amount fell out of this poor woman's bag on an MBTA train, it would be washed away the next time someone mops the car.
Nor is there any reason to test EMTs or police officers for cyanide poisoning, provided that they didn't eat or drink anything they found at the scene.
There are some unusually hazardous chemicals that should be subject to special handling restrictions, but lots and lots of very ordinary chemicals are poisonous, and you can't operate a chemical lab if ordinary chemicals like cyanide are locked down. Cyanide is not qualitatively different from bromadiolone (rat poison) that anyone can buy at Home Depot.
It's also worth noting that
It's also worth noting that many old photos and blueprints were created using cyanotype. Anything printed with a blueish tint chemically reproduced prior to about the 1940s typically will have trace amounts of cyanide.
Science Education Needed
This guy should go take Chemistry at RCC or BHCC. Seriously.
Moreover, maybe he should do a bit of serious thinking and data gathering.
Let's see, how many people killed by cyanide in suicides, homicides and mass-murder sprees in MA? 1 suicide
How many killed by guns?
Sheesh, a hardware store in Medford had an incident where a disgruntled employee spilled bleach and ammonia in order to terrorize the other workers. Let's ban those! How did he get bleach and ammonia? "Pathogens" like bleach and ammonia!
The stupid is really poisonous. Really. What is it these jerkweed city councilors have against the biggest employers in the area? Other than not being able to control them through the usual patronage channels?
Good job, Mr. Public Safety Man
You tell'em, Steve!
There's only a billion worse things in the world than someone taking a few mgs of cyanide home and killing themself...but you talk tough about these so-called "chemists" and their ability to kill us all if given the chance!
Did you know some of these people even have access to RADIOACTIVE MATERIALS!? They could easily lie about an experiment failing and take that stuff home with them instead of using it in the lab! You know what's worse than a "pathogen" like cyanide? Radioactive cyanide!! OH NOES!
...moron.
All he wants is a hearing right?
I mean, all he is asking is to see if colleges are doing enough to protect people from possible harm. I don't see the big deal in that.
From the outside, this just looks like something that was unavoidable, but it doesn't really hurt to review policies every once in a while.
reviewing policies is great...
... but creating a hysterical scare where there is no need is irresponsible and make your look like a doofus.
he could have gone about this in a better way.
Yea that may be true
but the Herald should take some or most of the blame then too right?
heh, don't get me started...
... on whether or not i think the folks at the herald are a bunch of doofuses ;)
The Herald isn't in an official position
Some young reporter can be criticized for not knowing the difference between a pathogen and a poison and a toxin.
Somebody paid in an official capacity for public safety should be fired for not understanding some pretty basic stuff.
I still don't get what the big deal is.
This woman allegedly stole chemicals from a college lab and these chemicals have the capacity to kill someone if they are injested.
What is the harm in finding out what the chemicals actually are, how they were take, where they were taken from, and if there are other chemicals that people can possibly take from college labs, and what are the college policies regarding these chemicals etc, etc?
What if she took a bottle of bleach?
Or acetic acid? These things are not regulated beyond safe handling and storage practices because they are not even as deadly as dumping out a bottle of bleach and a bottle of ammonia together would be. This is yet again another attempt at pathetic grandstanding by an idiot politician who doesn't have the first clue about something he is supposed to have the first clue - and second clue - about.
OMFG! Her CAR had a highly volatile and explosive liquid in it!!!!
Oh, and for additional stupid: Mr. Public Safety should have some clue about the regulation of chemical transport and storage and who has that authority (hint: it ain't the city) and how the hazard classification systems work for both OSHA and the DOT before asking any questions about how the universities handle their chemicals.
He can buy a nice little pocket-sized book about all of it at the UMass Lowell bookstore. It is bright orange and official looking when you carry it around.
In this case would it be pathetic grandstanding...
or pathogenic grandstanding? ;-)
No, he's going above and beyond
First, according to the Globe, it's not even concluded if the cyanide she had was from Northeastern. You could buy this yourself from Sigma-Aldrich for about $50 and have it shipped straight to your door.
But, let's assume it was. What's the risk here? Again, it's not like you couldn't buy tons of things that are "toxic" from chemical suppliers...enough to kill whole neighborhoods if you wanted to. There are enough homebrew recipes on the internet for killing people that you don't even need to get chemicals from a supplier. You could get a bunch of stuff at Home Depot and mix them.
So, essentially, "investigating" the storage/inventory of a chemical lab (and trust me, there's stuff on the shelves of every lab that they have no idea they even have any of any more) is just going to be effort and energy without making anyone safer...but just "talking safe" these days and making these sorts of "investigations" wins votes...because we can always be safer, right? And government's only purpose is to make us safer today than yesterday, right? It's just political hogwash.
Wasting Public Resources
If they really want to make life safer, how about asking some questions about the security of the rail yards that tankers full of chemicals roll through and sit in. There is a huge potential for trouble there. Can you imagine what would happen if some terrorist with a backpack bomb paid a visit to an idle chlorine tanker at rush hour?
Anyone remember the chlorine tanker leak at Sullivan?
Meanwhile, Amy Bishop, with access to all these chemicals, chose a gun for her mayhem.
One question that should be asked: why did a terminated employee have access to the premises where hazardous materials were stored?
Not yet terminated
The Globe article says "Her grant-funded position was set to expire at the end of the month."
Murphy is a dolt, but ...
I still find it pretty creepy that she might possibly have gotten on the same train I did Saturday morning at Ruggles. (She apparently got off at Route 128, while I continued to South Attleboro)
Yeah, but if that was the case...
Imagine how _she_ felt!