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Train of the damned: Red Line riders stuck for three hours before being evacuated through tunnel
By adamg on Tue, 07/12/2011 - 1:52pm
Carly Marie was on the dead Red Line train between Harvard and Porter this morning and took this photo before stepping down to the tracks for a tunnel walk. She adds:
Made it through two episodes of @ThisAmerLife and today's @nytimes crossword, plus some Angry Birds and Tetris during today's MBTA fiasco.
Elizabeth Bond was also on the train:
Bond reports:
I was in the last car of the train so I had to wait for the 13 cars ahead of me to evacuate and didn't make it out until 12:30. When they decided to evacuate us they had to cut the power off so they could cut the third rail off. For the last hour, hour and a half, there was no AC but the firemen were passing out water bottles.
Wicked Local Cambridge interviewed some of the trapped passengers:
"There's some camaraderie," said Flynn, 34, who was headed to work in Harvard Square. The tunnel between Porter and Harvard squares is one of the deepest in the system and passengers marveled at the earthen walls and stalactites hanging from the ceiling.
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Comments
2+ hours for an evac. - Holy Schnikies
Reposted here, since this thread went up whilst I was writing on the other thread.
This situation is one of my nightmares, and frankly, it's the reason that I always carry food, water and a flashlight when on the T and also why I generally avoid it nowadays (to all those who made fun of me for carrying those provisions - well?). The condition of the system has become so bad that I am not entirely comfortable riding it anymore.
On a related note, Boston.com is reporting that the time from the beginning of the problem to the completion of the evacuation was greater than 2 hours. I know that things have to be done to maximize safety, but seriously, 2 hours is totally unacceptable. I am a relatively young guy in good shape and health, and even I would not be in very good condition without food and particularly water after 2+ hours in those conditions.
Perhaps the most disturbing thing about this is that it demonstrates that the T would have a very, very difficult time in the event of some kind of catastrophe such as a large fire, or some kind of attack. So bad, in fact, that I'm sorry I even brought it up.
I feel so bad for those 700+ people.
hardship?
Carrying water, snacks and a flashlight is not a bad idea at all (provided you're always going around with a backpack or some other man-bag). And if you don't like confined spaces then really, it's a good idea to not take the T as it seems like this is happening more often these days, especially the Red Line.
But honestly, if you would not be in good condition just because you're sitting on a train for two hours without food and water...uh... that's not a good sign.
I don't feel bad about those folks -- I'd love to take a trek through the T tunnels -- although if I had to be somewhere I'd probably be pissed.
Speaking Of Pissed...
I would assume the worst thing for some would have been the desire to evacuate (and I'm not talking about the trek through the tunnel.)
Suldog
http://jimsuldog.blogspot.com
Word!
If you take medication that makes you drink a lot, are pregnant, or are just lacking in bladder capacity due to age or physiology, that could really suck.
It goes against all our earliest training...
...but there are some times when it is unreasonable not to piss yourself. The agony of embarassment---at least for some of us, which fortunately includes my aspie self---is as nothing to the agony of an over-full bladder.
A classic solution
On wagon trains, women would circle around one another and take turns, holding their skirts out to the side, facing out, to provide privacy on the plains.
I'm sure T passengers might be able to organize privacy in some similar way, although the lack of coats in summer would be an issue. Gym towels?
No Air Conditioning
"But honestly, if you would not be in good condition just because you're sitting on a train for two hours without food and water...uh... that's not a good sign."
The Globe article mentioned the AC cut out after an hour or so. On a 95 degree day, it might be tough to go more than an hour with no water and no air conditioning, especially in a packed subway car.
no ac
The article mentions that being one of the deepest of the T tunnels it was far cooler down there than up at ground level. Still must have been a bit uncomfortable though.
My biggest deal would have been bladder-related.
So you think it was 95
So you think it was 95 degrees in that tunnel?
No, but according to the
No, but according to the comments on the Globe article, it gets hotter as you go further down (it's actually cooler when you're underground but closer to the surface). I was on a train yesterday where the air shut off for just a few minutes. On a crowded train, it gets hot very quickly.
Not quite just sitting on a train shooting the breeze.
What the commenters above said. It wouldn't have been just the temperature issue. The humidity must have been terribly high. I have to wear a suit to work. Most are wool. Although my jacket would have been off, I don't think that I could have gotten away with taking my pants off (or my shirt for that matter), and on a day like today, the hottest day of the year so far, I was just commenting that I wasn't sure I would have been feeling fabulous (I sweat a lot and have a high metabolism, so I eat and drink regularly during the day).
Perhaps I should be carrying gatorade too, but that's not the point. Notwithstanding my personal issues, should I or anyone else have to take these precautions on a daily basis just for the *privilege* of riding public transit to work? Why does it seem to be too much to ask to have a reasonably comfortable, safe and efficient ride to work on public transit? This is one of the wealthiest, most innovative cities in the world in the wealthiest country in the world - how can we have public transit system that is so poor?
Great question!
You're entirely correct - you shouldn't have to plan a trip on the Red Line like an expedition to the backcountry. And those are really good questions you closed with. The House of Representatives' Transportation and Infrastructure Committee just released an outline of our national transportation bill and it's completely under the thumb of the Tea Partiers death grip on the GOP. Despite our massive backlog of maintenance that must occur to get our transit system up to snuff, the House is talking about effectively cutting the amount of funding relative to what's been received in the past. As long as we as a nation believe that govt services such as transportation (transit, highways, etc.) are things that we should just receive for free - i.e., no investment into maintaining it or improving it -- then we will have a continually decaying system that results in people being stuck in tunnels.
what happens to the infirm?
I don't ride the T anymore, but every time I hear these stories I wonder what would happen to a person like me, disabled and unable to walk my way out. Do they provide for the handicapped that do use the T? Do the provide wheelchairs for the elderly and infirm? I have no clue, but the fear keeps me using The Ride, operated by the MBTA and a total nightmare much of the time.
Evacuation Chair
I've noticed signs on a box installed at the stations saying "Evacuation Chair".
Porter Square has no elevator service right now
as it is in the process of being replaced. I sure hope there weren't any wheelchair users on those two trains.
If the escalators are
If the escalators are working, it would be very easy for emergency responders to help wheelchair users evacuate. Some wheelchair users can ride escalators without any help.
Sounds like the fire dept was
Sounds like the fire dept was on scene fairly early.
I understand your concern but I'm sure you'd be taken care of first.
This next note is not directed anyone with limitations but just in general response to other posters:
I've seen a few emergency situations on the T and elsewhere in public.
I've never seen a Lord of the Flies situation develop and never read about it either.
You might get thirsty and might have to piss or sit down but if you're reasonably healthy you'll be OK.
Swirly, I bet the girls on the train would circle ' round if necessary and I like to think common sense would prevail if anyone else had to void.
Personnel were on scene as well.I bet you could have gotten off to discreetly urinate if you promised not to electrocute yourself.
If not I don't see opprobrium coming down if nature calls.
Around 11 AM, an hour after
Around 11 AM, an hour after the problem developed, there were no announcements in the station while while I waited for a train headed for the blockage. How hard would it be for someone in the control center to type, "Shuttle buses Harvard-Alewife", and click "post to all subway station signs"?
Once a train arrived, the conductor was nice enough to announce that the last stop would be Harvard.
At least I had a pass, so I didn't have to pay a non-refundable fare for a train that didn't get me where I was going.
No Announcements is de rigueur...
As a long-time commuter rail, subway, and bus user, I've come to the conclusion (quite awhile ago actually) that we, the riders, are nothing more than paying cattle to the MBTA. Tell us what's happening?? pfah! why bother??
Was it obvious to stay away
Was it obvious to stay away from the 3rd rail, or did they have to remind people?
3rd rail had power cut...
....before they unloaded the train. This would account for a few minutes of the delay...but sheesh am I glad I missed that.
Did this happen outbound or inbound?
The Globe article says that trains got stuck in the outbound tunnel. But two people I know were on *inbound* trains, and had to evacuate by walking through the tunnel. Anyone know definitively what happened where?
I think the Globe was wrong.
I think the Globe was wrong. I vaguely remember that the T website's poorly-worded status update mentioned a disabled "IB" train.
hook it up
just wondering why the train could not be pushed by another train or is it some power issue. seems if it was cupled to another train it could be slowly pushed to the station they must have pushed it when the people got off. i dont think they fixed it in the tunnel. or is it some obscure rule.
They tried that
the second train also broke down after they coupled it and they ended up with two disabled trains.
it was the inbound side
The Globe is wrong on two counts. It was an inbound train stuck between Porter and Harvard, and it got stuck a little after nine. I was in Harvard Station at 9:15. The system announced that the next Braintree train was arriving, but it never came in. At around 9:25 a T worker came down the platform, telling everyone that there was a disabled train that would be coming in and that it would be leaving passengers for, as she put it, the "plenty of service right behind" the disabled train. At about 9:45 they reversed an outbound train on the upstairs platform - without, of course, telling anyone on the inbound platform that that's what they were doing - and did so again just before 10. At that time they had not yet announced shuttle service, and were giving no one any information about what was happening.
The last Red Line evacuation near Porter Square
All of two months ago, on the Davis side. Also note the prescient first comment on that post.
Bested
Darn. Now when I mention that I was stuck on a Red Line train for 2 hours once, I'll probably have to follow up with, "No, the one that was a couple of months before that one. I didn't get to walk through the tunnel."
I enjoyed the reaction of the kids that were interviewed on the noon news. They thought it was "awesome."
New money-making venture for
New money-making venture for the T: after-hours tunnel walks! See the stalactites (which actually sound cool), give the tourists an authentic Boston experience, sell expensive popcorn and snacks. I'd pay --if only so I know what's going to happen when it's my turn to walk the tunnel.
Too bad James Brolin wasn't on the train
It was around 9:00 am
I walked into Harvard station at 9:10 am with some friends. There was already a larger than normal crowd on the platform. After a while, we started getting automated (computer-generated) announcements that the next train through the station would not take passengers and that there were delays due to a disabled train at Harvard (which of course sounded fishy since we were at Harvard). At 9:30 we walked upstairs and took a cab. Cabs were already hard to find in the square.
http://www.bostonherald.com/news/regional/view/201...
The Herald says that the evacuation began around 10:00 am. That agrees better with my observations. Or maybe 10:00 am is when the T finally notified the fire department that an evacuation was required.
That makes about THREE and a half hours between the initial breakdown and the last evacuation at 12:30 pm.
security problem
It's been obvious for years that the MBTA cannot handle emergency situations.
In the scenario of a major security incident in an MBTA station, the only way you're going to get anyone out alive is if federal agents already have a plan to jump in and shoot any MBTA personnel so that civilians can be escorted to safety.
MBTA emergency response plan otherwise: barricade people into the trains or stations where the incident is occurring, have employees say only "another train is right behind this one" no matter what the question or reality, and play PA announcements implying that the riders are fare evaders.
Why are we still paying for this crap?
It's old, it barely functions, and it hemorrhages cash. Buy everybody a car and be done with it. Detroit needs help? Tell 'em to build cheap cars for all current T users, and put the trolley in a museum where it belongs with other relics of its time.
And stop making people drive to work at 8 AM every day with everybody else if their job doesn't in 2011 require them to physically be at a job site. Why am I the only person who gets this? Why is everyone else dense except for me?
Buy everybody a car?
That's a huge part of the problem ... cars take up far more room than we can possibly construct roadways to put them on!
Not that we are doing so well with our roadways *cough* Storrow Drive *cough* fast 14 *cough*
Also, do you really want everyone to drive?
Epileptics? Blind people? Kids under 15 years old? Convicted drunk drivers?
What about those self-driving cars
That do it all for you? http://www.nytimes.com/2010/10/10/science/10google...
Blind people driving
It is my understanding that the MBTA operates a program known as "The Ride" that provides transport for the less advantaged among us, including the blind.
As for people not of driving age, that's what buses are for. It's the subway trains that appear to be the big problem here. I'm not at all advocating for getting rid of public transit entirely, but I have no idea why we keep doing it the MBTA way either.
"The definition of insanity is doing the same thing repeatedly and expecting different results." - Albert Einstein
Have you ever ridden the MBTA
Have you ever ridden the MBTA bus system? It's about 10 times worse than the subway in terms of reliability, comfort, and on time performance. Buses are consistently late or bunch up, and it's quite a bit slower due to traffic and not having a dedicated right of way as on a subway. Those are inherent problems with buses themselves - inevitably, they'll get stuck up in traffic and be late and bunch up and stuff like that.
And with all the cars that are added to the roads according to your plan, the buses will be at a snail's pace with all that traffic.
You're making half of my point, Swirly
I have a friend who lives in Brighton. His job requires him to commute to New Hampshire to work with Fidelity. You know what his job is? He calculates pensions. That's right. His entire effing job function is to field calls and e-mails, and to do math to serve customers. There is little, if any, reason for him to drive to an office to do that job.
Get his car off the road during peak hours. If he needs to go in for a meeting, fine. But the idea that he needs to be on the road every weekday at 8 AM is lunacy and not realistic in the 21st century.
I agree with that half of your point
I wish the T didn't force people into cars by having such rigid notions of working hours as well.
But the main point stands: car travel is not the most cost efficient method for everyone in an urban area - not only is the infrastructure vastly more expensive per trip, it is also simply impossible to build enough roads.
Will has solved it! Demand-driven open road tolling it is!
I think you made, perhaps unintentionally, a great argument for the cheapest and best short term solution to traffic that we have:
Demand-driven open road tolling, i.e., the greater the demand for roadway resources at a given time, the greater the price.
Will's friend would definitely not be driving to NH at 8 am everyday if it was going to cost him 5-10x what it would to drive up at noon (and only once or twice a week). Yeah, I know. Your boss says you have to be at work at 9. That would not be the case if this were implemented, because there would be massive pushback from all employees everywhere, and since bosses need their employees to keep making money, accommodations would be made. (N.B., I have a hand in running a business, and we would definitely figure out a way to deal with it.)
But fear not, we-already-paid-for-those-roads-folk (but did you really, what about the maintenance amongst other costs?), it will not happen in our lifetimes on anything but a newly constructed roadway. And since there will not be any newly constructed roadways anywhere around here (excepting, perhaps, the pipe-dream east-west connector in northern Maine) in our lifetimes, it will never happen so far as we're concerned.
So we will muddle through, slowly choking our economy on traffic (since I have little hope of a bonafide high speed rail system in my lifetime, either) and the lost productivity that it brings, whilst other countries invest in their infrastructure and drive down the costs of doing business and increase productivity. Now that sounds like sound economic policy, doesn't it Washington?
and where would we put all these cars?
Do we get free parking at home and work too?
Free parking?
What is your occupation? Do you drive a car to work every day because it's absolutely necessary, or could you just do your work on the Internet and over the phone without your boss making you tie up the roadway?
I don't own a car
I take the T.
And since my work involves seeing patients, yes I have to go into work.
You said forget the T and buy everyone cars. Those cars need to go somewhere. I don't actually want a car, I want good public transportation.
THE LEGEND OF WHITEY LIVES ON
Whitey murders twenty people and is transported around in motorcades and helicopters worthy of a third world despot. I on the other hand failed to pay a parking ticket and was forced to walk in the Tunnel of Doom all the while reminding myself of a modern day jean Valjean of Les Miserables. I am betting that the sewers of Paris and the T- Tunnels have the same aroma.
Sorry, but no ones license
Sorry, but no ones license or plates gets suspended or revoked in Mass for failing to pay one parking ticket. After you neglect to pay a few (I believe 3), they won't allow you to renew without squaring away your tickets.
EDIT: I should point out that moving violations are a whole 'nother story. Fail to pay one of those, and you're in a world of hurt. Not paying excise tax, Fast Lane violations, and parking tickets only puts you in a "non-renew" status.
I can't wait
...until you start complaining about the incredibly large traffic jams and the skyrocketing price of parking and fuel. See: Los Angeles. (where they are currently building light rail and subways, at a rapid pace, btw).
As for the second point, amen. Of course, I don't go to work at 8 AM myself :)
What we have here is failure to communicate...
I'd like to know why the driver of the 96 bus that dropped me off in Davis Square didn't bother to mention "Oh, by the way, the Davis Square trains aren't functioning, you should just stay on this bus all the way to Harvard." I know the bus people are a separate thing from the subway guys, but is there seriously no way to flash the bus drivers of those routes a warning message so they can inform passengers? If I had stayed on the 96 bus, I would've made it to my job interview on time. Instead, I was 2 hours late and covered in sweat. Thanks, guys. Great job on the communication.
Communication breakdown
Oh, I was waiting at Davis for a shuttle bus for about an hour (see liveblogging here), and someone asked the T employee dealing with the shuttle buses when the Red Line might start running again.
His response? "I don't know; I'm just the bus guy. The train people don't tell the bus people anything."